Hi apologies if this is in the wrong forum. Had an interesting chat out of the blue whilst watching the worldcup last night with my 17 year old boy . For his age group he is top 100 uk. in first year of A levels. Comprehensive school. Never played an ITF. Highest been in uk for his age group prob about 40.
Anyway he asked me how can he enjoy tennis anymore . He suggested that in the uk its all negative so how can he possibly be positive on Court if he is surrounded by negativity. I was taken aback and asked what he meant.
he said his coaches at an academy need wins from him . Anything less is negative. Always fighting to get into events or increase ratings is negative as he cant enjoy the experience. Tennis at home whilst isnt the centre of our lives certainly has an impact So he felt that was negative .
i have had to think long and hard. He probably has a point. He has been at an academy for years Perhaps to keep him in the game and to fall back in love he needs to have a break or join a local club to just play.
it concerns me of course as I wonder on this day being Fathers Day what have we put him through
would be interested in listening to others here who have seen this with their kids around this age as I have heard from coaches that this is when we lose so many
Play with adults in a club they will love him, we have a lad similar standard but never touched an academy plays at national level, just squeezed in last year. It is important to keep things in perspective being ranked 40 in the U.K. is amazing particularly if he is on track academically. All in favour of academies but also essential to keep your toe in a club playing competitive tennis purely for the fun of it.
I work with or have worked with a number of colleagues who were coached intensively and played tennis competitively as juniors, they now play for fun and have without exception been very successful in their chosen field which can be very demanding and on occasions brutal, having tennis to fall back on as an outlet is an excellent safety valve
College sport is generally a very positive experience if you do it recreationally and he probably has an opportunity to a bit more than that!
I think thrashing adults often is very good for older juniors psyche, as is being made captain and having to sort out the tea money.
Thanks for the response. The club idea is a good one. Its been on my mind. He has engaged with a local coach at a club who i can tell you makes him feel so much better than the academy chaps. Academy tennis is all he has known. Very interesting to hear about your young chap at national level. Is that in the UK? He played a match yesterday and the ref who hasn't seen him play in a while asked him where he had gone? Where was the kid with flair and creativity with a smile. Has become an academy robot. To his credit he listened and in the next match the drop shots returned, the cheek to even attempt certain shots returned and so did the smile. So i am hopeful and with the club idea its something to explore. Your example of a young player (how old?) is fantastic. Once again tho with the LTAs new performance plans for kids up to 14 years old there is a huge risk there will be many that are lost and end up giving up the game
-- Edited by Kolohead on Monday 18th of June 2018 01:49:08 PM
I think it sounds like he's not quite at a level where he's going to be able to make a living from playing (though coaching could be a potential avenue if he wants to go down that route), so finding something he enjoys would be the priority, and it doesn't sound like he's going to get that from the academy.
yeah you are probably right regarding making a living from playing, and we have no visions of that happening although never say never and shatter a dream of course. He will come to that conclusion himself as we all did if we ever dreamed of being a pro sportsperson of any type. Its an insight as to what goes wrong with performance and the pressure we put on the kids. There are many like this who given the chance may be able to make a living but thats life and the society we live in today.
Yep it is in the UK, the youngster is year 12 but still 16. Tennis playing family but not professionally, just all good. I don't think he will be professional either but is thoroughly enjoying the opportunity to compete. I think it's that balance you need to win a third easily. Win a third just and loose a third and adjust the levels you play at nobody likes getting moaned at and hammered every week.
There is an academy locally but they also nurture good but not elite players ie. a group session a week and then back to clubs.
I was doing a group session on Sunday a good year 8 was waiting for her dad, the coach called her in and she did 15 minutes for fun until he turned up with a mixed group who can all play. On Saturday an academy player turned up needed a grass court to practice on and the club coach facilitated it.
I think it is a lot to do with leadership in academies a certain degree of humbleness and the relationships the academies have with club coaches and the clubs themselves.
Yeah, I don't want to destroy a dream or anything, but as we know, you basically have to be in the top 400 or so men, or top 300 or so women in the world to make a decent living out of tennis. And that means (usually) you have to be in the very very elite for your age group in your country. If he's enjoying his tennis, fine, ignore the odds and let him carry on and he may be a James Ward or similar outlier who makes the grade despite being (relatively) low ranked as a junior. But if he's not enjoying it, then it seems time to play the odds.
I think there are huge structural issues with development of youngsters in the UK, and revenue sharing for professionals, but I don't think either look likely to be resolved before your son is your age!
Hi Kolohead. I would agree with the others that joining a local club would be a great idea. Hopefully he would also find a more supportive coach.
I have two tennis playing daughters now aged 23 and 21 who are still enjoying the game. The older one was ranked number one in UK at under 18 for about 5 months and was a national junior doubles champion We couldn't afford to take her to many ITFs but she was ranked 1200 or so after only 5 tournaments. She never went to an academy, ( nor did she want to although there was one locally) but stayed at a local club with a lovely coach who always managed to find something positive to say even when she had lost badly. The LTA were never interested in her, she was never invited to regional or national training and never had any funding at all, so I am very proud of what she achieved with no help from the LTA.
Both girls went to a state grammar school who let them have time off for tournaments / training as long as they kept up with their academics, so they were very lucky.
The older girl got a tennis scholarship to an American university ( she had a horrid coach so choose carefully if your son decides to go down that route) and the younger one is just finishing at a UK university where she was first team captain and playing almost as much tennis as her older sister.
What has kept them both enthused about tennis is the social side of the game - they both loved playing mixed and ladies doubles for their local club, and again were lucky that their club encouraged juniors to play doubles matches for them; they always made themselves available for County Week, despite a local grade 2 being on at the same time, and have loved the team atmosphere at university and county events; they have tennis friends all over the country and our older daughter is now coaching at another local club and loving it . If your son is unhappy I would definitely recommend that you find a friendly welcoming club which has a positive attitude towards juniors.
I would totally second The Realist's suggestions re a friendly club. The academies are geared towards training kids for the professional ranks and there's not a lot of fun to be had although coaching should be a good standard. There should also be other kids of a good standard to play with. If the professional ranks are not close at age 17, there is b-all tennis in this country for young adults. It's a bit like practicing a musical instrument for hours and then having no-one to play to. Although there are still sadly (as mentioned in the LTA strategy thread) many clubs run for an elite middle aged and upwards set, these clubs are slowly dying on their feet - new members are increasingly hard for them to come by. The more forward thinking clubs aim for a family and inclusive membership, run lots of play-in sessions to help club members get to know each other, kids sessions, enter into the aegon league and dubs leagues, have challenge ladders, club championships etc etc. If he's been at an academy he's obviously a more than competent player, pick your club wisely and he will be welcomed with open arms. And whilst the standard may not be as consistently high as in the academy, there usually are some very good players and also plenty of quirky players who can be much more interesting to take the court with.
Academies, whilst sounding like a good idea and providing a good pathway for those destined for greatness, are utterly soulless places for everyone else. Whilst they will be happy to continue to take your money, once they have realised that a youngster's potential is not stellar their interest wanes making their charges feel like rejects and no-hopers. Most good (but not spectacular) kids who go through academies end up very negative about the sport - it is (as your son says) all about results (part of their funding is calculated based on the ratings of their junior players) and not at all about enjoyment. Very few carry on playing into later life. Contrast this with club players who usually manage to fit a bit of time on court through university, working life and beyond.
My son is 18 and since aged 12 has combined training at an academy with playing for a couple of local tennis clubs men's team and mixed and has always really enjoyed it. Local clubs provide great mix of ages and some really good players (often coaches) and it's fun!
Academies are very mixed: he ended up at a " sausage factory" for a couple of years just because that's where all of his peers were, but always took his individual lessons at a local club and 1 strong evening squad a week at the other local academy ( would have done all his squads at the other academy if level had been strong enough). He was never one of the "chosen few" at the "sausage" academy and alongside others who were also top 25 age group nationally was virtually ignored in squads. The "sausage " factory head coach went out of his way to be obstreperous, as though top 25 in age groups my son wasn't funded by LTA and apparently this was an issue, tried to block my son having free access to courts, pool and gym - the council who owned the courts gave free use to any athlete who represented the county (not just tennis players). The coach also refused to let my son drop squads for a half a term whilst revising for GCSE exams - we dropped them (and the academy) anyway.
Had to laugh when they phoned up to beg my son to do AASE at the centre! He voted with his feet (along with 90% of his peers) and went to the other academy where he has always thoroughly enjoyed squads, where the coaches were interested and motivated, also flexible about fitting training around exam revision and full time school. All of the players return to do squads when they are home from uni, also gets a chance to hit with the pros who train there. HAPPY!
Koloh - Don't keep a child where they are not happy, sure your son will be better off enjoying his tennis at a local club rather than miserable and pressured at the academy.
-- Edited by Elegant Point on Friday 22nd of June 2018 08:27:34 PM
Wow I really appreciate the feedback . Very enlightening and informative . For sure this is his last term at this academy and I can relate lots to what you have all said especially about the soulless place and when they realise your child is not going to make them famous coaches . I am going to look for local clubs as the academy is all we have known. He is smiling again and told me he has ignored the robotic coaches this week and played drop volleys when he feels like it and has hit a few hot dogs when perhaps he could have chased it down to have some fun. I too am proud where he has got to being at a state school and not had a individual coach for years as I refuse to pay for a coach that he doesnt believe in or a junior thrown at us at £40 per hour so they can make more money.
I really do appreciate the comments if I could I would buy you all a beer or a wine
