Andy's ranking in 2008

goldfish · Futures qualifying

RE: Andy's ranking in 2008

wolf · Tennis legend

Andy played and lost his first matches in both Barcelona & Rotterdam.

seagull · Hall of fame

Apparently it was Valencia

steven · Tennis legend

I just checked back through the top 25 tables - Valencia is the only other w/d this year that I can find so I agree, that must be it. That was because of a virus though - see http://andymurray.com/news/article/132. He also withdrew from New Haven having been given a WC, when he had recovered from something but didn't feel ready to compete - see http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/main.jhtml?xml=/sport/2007/08/16/stmurr116.xml.

If it is one of those events we're talking about, it's a bit harsh to count Indy as a second offence - I'm sure a lot of other players would have been less honest about what was going on.

-- Edited by steven at 01:57, 2008-07-22

daisy · County player

Those reports would indicate that an appeal might succeed.
He withdrew with a virus from Valencia and a continuing injury worry from Newport so he may well get the points re-instated.

He's been honest about his withdrawal from Indianapolis (to rest - rather than fake an injury) and knowing how good he is with stats and stuff I'd guess he knew the rules on this. He may not have thought the ATP would penalise him though - especially if he believed this was a first offence as those reports would imply.

indiana · Tennis legend

I think part of the problem with Indianapolis is that Andy has such a complex about some folk considering him injury prone that he was almost too blunt about being in no way injured, but just taking a rest, which maybe didn't amuse the ATP ! ( or Indy who had him well featured on their website )

Hopefully it is more a slapped wrist and will be revoked, especially considering the apparent circumstances of earlier withdrawals.

However, even on this forum, as soon as Andy withdrew there was some speculation about the zero point scenario, so one would have assumed the Murray camp would have checked out how they stood ?

Just realsied that after Cincinnati, which again I think will count double for a couple of weeks, Andy will be due to lose another optional, just 200 points this time ! Don't despair folk, he will get the 120 and 200 back in a short while, and once they are added back to his stellar Canada and Cincinnati this year and last year's less than stellar results are taken off, then all will be good ! smile

imoen · Admin: Moderator+Tennis Legend

Don't forget the points he's going to add when he wins the US open (and winning the Olympics of course) these puny 75 points are going to be nothing!!!

Seriously though, it looks like this might be another mistake from the Murray camp, though I can't say I blame Andy for taking the week off, why did he enter in the first place? He always knew it was going to be the beginning of a long series of events.

So here's a question for the members who've read the rulebook...how long does the 0 points stay on? To the end of the season (ie in the race) or for the full year (ie in the entry rankings)?

Oh and KFP Nadal withdrew from Stockholm becuase of sheer exhaustion, I don't think you can penalise him for that.

Salmon · Tennis legend

Yes, but is exhaustion a good enough reason to withdraw? I don't think it classifies as proper injury because it is hard to define how much exhaustion you need to suffer to prevent yourself from playing.

Granted it's not possible to play a Tour event after winning a Slam (why he entered in the first place is a mystery) but I'm sure that soon we'll have someone saying that they're exhausted after losing a tough second round match and you can't say no to him, either.

This rule has too many loopholes and needs to be done away with, I guess. You can prove someone to be unfit like it happens in team sports like cricket or football, but it's impossible to prove someone fit by force.

-- Edited by Kung Fu Panda at 00:50, 2008-07-22

steven · Tennis legend

imoen wrote:
So here's a question for the members who've read the rulebook...how long does the 0 points stay on? To the end of the season (ie in the race) or for the full year (ie in the entry rankings)?

For the full year, I'm afraid - as evidence, Mahut's zero-pointer from Washington around this time last year is still part of his best 18 and he has a 15 not counting.

indiana · Tennis legend

Andy is still provisionaly ranked no 9, currently on 1735 points ( could / should have been 1855 points, but let's not go there again )

Could theoretically get as high as 6th or as low as 10th.

But to reach no 6, he would have to win the tournament and Blake not reach the final ( if Andy beat Blake in the final, he'd be no 7 ).

To fall to no 10, he would have to lose in the quarters with Gasquet reaching the final, or lose in the semis with Gasquet winning the tournament.

I'd put a fair amount of money on Andy remaining in 9th place

Addition : OK, let's go there again. After Cincinnati, the Indy zero pointer will temporaily be costing Andy 200 points !! Indy and this year's calendar are proving an evil mix around this time. And it's on those rankings that I would presume the seedings for the Olympics will be based. Ah...

indiana · Tennis legend

Darn, didn't put that money on !!!

9th ranking, but hey 6th in race

It looks like Roddick and Blake are going to have to do very well in the next few weeks, Cincinnati in particular, to stop Andy overtaking them in the rankings once last year's Canada and Cincinnati scores are taken off. Although if Andy does very well too, they may be snookered anyway

.

By the way, I have a question, not on Andy's ranking, but Almagro's.

Does anyone understand why in the ATP ankings and race, he has not been given a zero score for Torionto last week, but been given an additional optional ? Unlike, Nalbandian for instance, who in his ranking points shows 10 ATP Maters Series entries including 0 for last week.

I would have had him on a ranking score of 1395 ( ATP = 1435 ) and race score of 238 ( ATP = 241 ),

I understood that if you miss a compulsory for whatever reason, that you are eligible for direct entry to, you score zero. What am I missing here ?

steven · Tennis legend

The Almagro thing is an ATP mistake (just like their 0 points for Nieminen when he did actually play and should have got 5) - it'll be interesting to see how long it is before they correct it. These little errors happen more often than you'd think, they're just not usually as noticeable as the Almagro one.

christian · Intermediate Club Player

Hi Steven, seeing as you're answering questions do you mind me asking a quick one. I've started doing my own noddy live rankings, top 10 only for now, just to make it easier for me to track Andy. Even though he's defending 200 points I still had him just in 9th as Wawrinka was losing 75 points, or at least that's what I thought.

Can you please explain the error of my ways as you have him down in 10th in your table.

cheers

Madeline · Admin:Moderator + Tennis Legend

If it is any consolation, Christian, he is still in ninth after this weeks points are taken off, in my spreadsheet too. We await Steven's explanation with bated breath. . .

I was pondering on the Almagro situation too, and came to the same conclusion as Steven - the ATP have dropped a boo-boo, not for the first time.

The Hoose · Satellite level

If you read Steven's small print it explains. Steven does a rough guess at where those ranking points would leave a player, on the basis of the current week's ranking points (i.e. he doesn't look into the points to defend/potential for gains of all the surrounding players)

Projected Rank = projected world ranking at the end of this week = where he would be ranked currently with these points unless a more accurate projection is easily available

-- Edited by The Hoose at 13:00, 2008-07-28