British Tennis Forum - Celebrating 20 Years!

B00thy · Club Coach

Weeks 40 & 41 - ATP Masters 1000 - Shanghai, China (hard)

JonH comes home · Tennis legend

Stircrazy wrote:
L64: (30) Cameron Norrie WR 33 defeated Arthur Cazaux (FRA) WR 70 by 6-3 0-6 7-6(5)
*****
L32: Learner Tien (USA) WR 36 (= CH) vs (30) Cameron Norrie WR 33
Tien beat Moutet (33) by 4-6 6-4 6-4.

Well done Cam! What happened set 2.

JonH comes home · Tennis legend

Sadly, Tien will beat Cam I think

JonH comes home · Tennis legend

Apparently Lloyd has had an abdominal muscle injury according to Harri, he doesnt know anything more but sees they are planning to play Stockholm.

B00thy · Club Coach

JonH comes home wrote:
Sadly, Tien will beat Cam I think

It could have gone either way against Cazaux, so feels like a bonus shot to me

JonH comes home · Tennis legend

B00thy wrote:
JonH comes home wrote:
Sadly, Tien will beat Cam I think
It could have gone either way against Cazaux, so feels like a bonus shot to me

Agreed. Tien will be top 20 in the near future, Cam has struggled since the US Open. Not sure this slow Shanghai surface helps him.

Actually, why have the slowed it down- its been an historically quick surface and all the players are complaining they have an extra abrasive surface this year which makes it v slow.

B00thy · Club Coach

That's interesting about the abrasive surface. Does that check the topspin I wonder? It seems to me that recently I've watched a few games where a higher percentage of what I thought were certain 'winners' in a rally were retrieved and I felt the slower court was letting the less deserving player back in, perpetuating the excitement for the crowd but rewarding the less attacking player. Just a feeling with no stats to back it up

indiana · Tennis legend

Beijing seemed very slow too. I kinda felt for Sonay and Andreeva as they really thumped ball after ball and they just sat up, to be returned unless a player was a fair bit out of position. Though it was still a very good watch and tbf I don't like really quick courts.

The unforced error counts also end up being maybe a bit unfair. Often most of them are worn down errors!

JonH comes home · Tennis legend

B00thy wrote:
That's interesting about the abrasive surface. Does that check the topspin I wonder? It seems to me that recently I've watched a few games where a higher percentage of what I thought were certain 'winners' in a rally were retrieved and I felt the slower court was letting the less deserving player back in, perpetuating the excitement for the crowd but rewarding the less attacking player. Just a feeling with no stats to back it up

Harri talks about it in his blog, how it probably helps the doubles spectacle but maybe not so much the singles as it is more war of attrition

https://www.harriheliovaara.fi/

Zverev also called it out in an interview, albeit his angle was more one of the powers that be wanted to help ensure Sinner and Alcaraz play in finals !

JonH comes home · Tennis legend

indiana wrote:
Beijing seemed very slow too. I kinda felt for Sonay and Andreeva as they really thumped ball after ball and they just sat up, to be returned unless a player was a fair bit out of position. Though it was still a very good watch and tbf I don't like really quick courts.

The unforced error counts also end up being maybe a bit unfair. Often most of them are worn down errors!

Tennis abstract rated beijing as middling pace this year based on mens action

https://tennisabstract.com/reports/atp_surface_speed.html

albeit a lot slower than last year. The Shanghai surface is said to be playing like Indian Wells, so that would be a lot slower than past seasons.

JonH comes home · Tennis legend

Neal and JP got beaten easily by Arevalo and Pavic, winning just 5 games.

Cam and Henry/Harri on shortly, I believe

indiana · Tennis legend

JonH comes home wrote:
Neal and JP got beaten easily by Arevalo and Pavic, winning just 5 games.

Cam and Henry/Harri on shortly, I believe

At 10.35 am, the singles match before Cam is at 6-5 in the first set. And the doubles match before Henry/Harri at 2-1 in the second set.

Stircrazy · Tennis legend

L16: (1) Marcelo Arévalo & Mate Pavic (ESA/CRO) CR 6 (3+3) defeated Neal Skupski & John-Patrick Smith (AUS) CR 58 (9+49) by 3 & 2 cry

indiana · Tennis legend

Henry & Harri are under way, 1-0*

And the match before Cam's has just finished.

indiana · Tennis legend

JonH comes home wrote:
B00thy wrote:
JonH comes home wrote:
Sadly, Tien will beat Cam I think
It could have gone either way against Cazaux, so feels like a bonus shot to me
Agreed. Tien will be top 20 in the near future, Cam has struggled since the US Open. Not sure this slow Shanghai surface helps him.

Actually, why have the slowed it down- its been an historically quick surface and all the players are complaining they have an extra abrasive surface this year which makes it v slow.

I would have said slow courts did suit Cam rather well just by his game. And on those slow Indian Wells courts he won the titie in 2021 and has twice subsequently been in quarter finals there.

Tien is betting favourite but not by that big a margin. 8/11 vs 11/10.