Yes, up to a point

i.e. Yes, it's great to see the Next Gen contingent doing well.

For clarity, our six remaining players are:

Jack PJ - born 2003
Oliver Tarvet - born 2003
Felix Gill - born 2002
Harry Wendelken - born 2001
Alastair Gray - born 1998
Stuart Parker - born 1997


However, there were several people some months ago (not me), saying Anton and Paul were way too good for ITFs, they should be playing challengers etc. Well, giving challengers a go is still a good idea, but it's hardly been a very positive showing from our better players (add Aidan to the Anton and Paul group)

So, if all we've done is moved our hopes from one young group to another slightly younger group, we're not really making much progress. Which is not blaming Jack, Oliver, Felix etc. (nor 'blaming' Anton, Paul and Aidan either, of course). But it's not necessarily good news.

(And with the caveat that I didn't see any/much of those matches - I got sucked into Oli Tarvet's match and that was that....)

emmsie69 wrote:

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Coup Droit wrote:

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Yes, up to a point

i.e. Yes, it's great to see the Next Gen contingent doing well.

For clarity, our six remaining players are:

Jack PJ - born 2003
Oliver Tarvet - born 2003
Felix Gill - born 2002
Harry Wendelken - born 2001
Alastair Gray - born 1998
Stuart Parker - born 1997


However, there were several people some months ago (not me), saying Anton and Paul were way too good for ITFs, they should be playing challengers etc. Well, giving challengers a go is still a good idea, but it's hardly been a very positive showing from our better players (add Aidan to the Anton and Paul group)

So, if all we've done is moved our hopes from one young group to another slightly younger group, we're not really making much progress. Which is not blaming Jack, Oliver, Felix etc. (nor 'blaming' Anton, Paul and Aidan either, of course). But it's not necessarily good news.

(And with the caveat that I didn't see any/much of those matches - I got sucked into Oli Tarvet's match and that was that....)

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 Nobody said Anton and Aidan should be playing challengers, what was said was given that both Aidan and Anton had played Challengers, why was Paul still playing 15k and 25k (and winning them) and not testing himself at Challenger level.  As it happens Aidan seems to have more success at Challenger level anyway and Anton has played 1 Challenger.

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 Yes indeed as Emmsie says, that was my view also. 

I definitely dont think Paul, Aidan and Anton have plateaued either to be honest. All 3 have recently reached career highs, I think both Aidan and Paul are more suited to the outdoor hardcourts or even clay, as is Billy, and I think they can push on once we get into spring or outdoor play. Anton worries me a little more I think but I think all of these players in that 300-500 cohort, lets add Ali and Stuart, will push on. 

which is why Im pleased the younger ones are beating them this week, largely , it means we have a good chance of that 500 or under cohort becoming much stronger . Dare I say it , 20 under 500 this year ? 

emmsie69 wrote:

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Coup Droit wrote:

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Yes, up to a point

i.e. Yes, it's great to see the Next Gen contingent doing well.

For clarity, our six remaining players are:

Jack PJ - born 2003
Oliver Tarvet - born 2003
Felix Gill - born 2002
Harry Wendelken - born 2001
Alastair Gray - born 1998
Stuart Parker - born 1997


However, there were several people some months ago (not me), saying Anton and Paul were way too good for ITFs, they should be playing challengers etc. Well, giving challengers a go is still a good idea, but it's hardly been a very positive showing from our better players (add Aidan to the Anton and Paul group)

So, if all we've done is moved our hopes from one young group to another slightly younger group, we're not really making much progress. Which is not blaming Jack, Oliver, Felix etc. (nor 'blaming' Anton, Paul and Aidan either, of course). But it's not necessarily good news.

(And with the caveat that I didn't see any/much of those matches - I got sucked into Oli Tarvet's match and that was that....)

---

 Nobody said Anton and Aidan should be playing challengers, what was said was given that both Aidan and Anton had played Challengers, why was Paul still playing 15k and 25k (and winning them) and not testing himself at Challenger level.  As it happens Aidan seems to have more success at Challenger level anyway and Anton has played 1 Challenger.

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 Actually, if you look back, there are definitely people who said they should be playing challengers - 'Anton is too good for ITFs' is one comment (not you). But I wasn't criticising - it's a fair point - the players have to push themselves and make the next step. And obviously most players have a balance of competitions.

The point is that two have done really poorly here - if our players had lost to foreign guys that much younger and lower ranked than them, we'd have been truly despondent (doesn't apply to Anton so much this time but he had a howler in the first event)

ADD: which of course doesn't mean they've plateaued - no question - never suggested - their average peak is age 26 or whatever (assuming they continue). So not possible they've plateaued now. Just highlighting some of the disappointment of this week, as well as the positives from others.  

-- Edited by Coup Droit on Thursday 10th of February 2022 08:36:33 AM

JonH comes home wrote:

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We also know how form can change and quickly. Dan and cam are great examples - dans second half of last year was torrid, partly Covid related, but hes opened this one well; cam had a great last year, started this v poorly but this week is coming back. Definitely wont right anyone off and overall it feels positive

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 As above, with the average peak age of 26, there was no question of writing anyone off.

But the gloss of the younger lot (which has been wonderful for us as spectators and fans) can't take away that it's been a pretty poor UK season for the higher ranked UK players.

I've watched Anton many a time live and he is such a talented player, but struggles for consistency and also in attitude.
He is capable of playing to a higher level, but needs consistency at 25k first.

Wow, stunning win for Harry Wendelken over Felix , 6-3 6-2.

This is a breakout week for the lad!

Lovely to see such a big (and noisy) crowd at Shrewsbury, on a Thursday morning.

Looks like it's mainly a school trip.

Great idea !