Week 41 - ATP Masters 1000 - Rolex Shanghai Masters - Shanghai, China (hard)

Stircrazy · Tennis legend

Week 41 - ATP Masters 1000 - Rolex Shanghai Masters - Shanghai, China (hard)

JonH comes home · Tennis legend

Simon is beatable but it will be a long old match , that's for sure. Here's betting on 3 hours and 3 sets

-- Edited by JonH comes home on Sunday 6th of October 2019 09:39:50 AM

JonH comes home · Tennis legend

Andy plays londero, good draw. Kyle v chardy, oh dear.

No lucky loser spots

Helen40 · Grand Slam Champion

JonH comes home wrote:
Andy plays londero, good draw. Kyle v chardy, oh dear.

No lucky loser spots

I'm hoping that there is still time..

Stircrazy · Tennis legend

Stircrazy wrote:
L56: (Q) Cameron Norrie WR 69 vs Gilles Simon (FRA) WR 50 (CH = 6 in January 2009 - he's now 34) - the winner will play Daniil Medvedev (3)
L56: (WC) Andy Murray WR 503 vs (Q) Juan Ignacio Londero (ARG) WR 59
L56: (Q) Jérémy Chardy (FRA) WR 72 vs Kyle Edmund WR 34 - the winner will play Sascha Zverev (5)

Head-to-heads:

Cam vs Simon: 0-1 (SF in Lyon last year 6-1 7-6(6) - clay)

Andy vs Londero: first meeting

Kyle vs Chardy: 2-1, all on clay (Chardy won the first encounter in the World Group quarter-final of the Davis Cup in 2017 by 4 & 4 & Kyle the next two, in the first round in Barcelona the same year (3 & 4) & the first round at RG this year (7-6(1) 5-7 6-4 4-6 7-5))

Bob in Spain · Tennis legend

Stircrazy wrote:
Stircrazy wrote:
L56: (Q) Cameron Norrie WR 69 vs Gilles Simon (FRA) WR 50 (CH = 6 in January 2009 - he's now 34) - the winner will play Daniil Medvedev (3)
L56: (WC) Andy Murray WR 503 vs (Q) Juan Ignacio Londero (ARG) WR 59
L56: (Q) Jérémy Chardy (FRA) WR 72 vs Kyle Edmund WR 34 - the winner will play Sascha Zverev (5)
Head-to-heads:
Cam vs Simon: 0-1 (SF in Lyon last year 6-1 7-6(6) - clay)
Andy vs Londero: first meeting
Kyle vs Chardy: 2-1, all on clay (Chardy won the first encounter in the World Group quarter-final of the Davis Cup in 2017 by 4 & 4 & Kyle the next two, in the first round in Barcelona the same year (3 & 4) & the first round at RG this year (7-6(1) 5-7 6-4 4-6 7-5))

I was at the Barcelona match up. From memory, Chardy tried to be very aggressive and made a lot of errors.

Coup Droit · Tennis legend

Chardy has always stated, openly, that he does not believe in the 'you're as good as your weakest link' argument.

He says: forget about your weaknesses, just practice your weapons, and if your weapons are good enough, you'll never have to deal with your weaknesses because the match won't even get that far.

So for Chardy, it's serve and forehand and the rest can go hang

I'm not sure I quite buy off on it, but he's got a point.

flamingowings · All-time great

All our men in singles are playing tomorrow + Joe and Rajeev in the doubles.

indiana · Tennis legend

As Dan has said he is rightly much more concerned about his WR than taking over as GB 1. And no doubt he would for one thing much rather have made the main draw here.

But anyway he has set the live target for next Monday at 1120 points. So a tough one for our 3 ( yes 3 ) theoretical contendors for that spot.

Live points before their R1 and stage needed to overtake Dan.

Kyle : 985 - needs to reach the QF 180 points.
Cam : 915 - needs to reach the SF 360 points.
Andy : 147 - needs the title 1000 points.

It will be a great week for one of them if Dan is not GB #1 next Monday.

Priesty · Challenger level

JonH comes home wrote:
Helen40 wrote:
flamingowings wrote:
Happy to see Cam get the win and qualify. Shame Dan couldn't join him but Dan's form has been the strongest out of our men this year so I have no worries about him going forward.
I was worried about burnout with Dan after yesterday's game, and his good run in Beijing.

It's interesting about Chardy and Dan practising together though, and am interested if that was a big factor? Would anyone who saw the match or has more information on that like to comment please?
Hi helen, I dont know for sure if they practice, but chardy is London based and does train in london so imagine as top players they will have done, as will he with other British players no doubt. I think any knowledge of someone's game close up helps. Andy mentioned he and Cam have played recently and Cam bettered him in practice, but then andy won the match. Federer and dan practices together as was well reported and then federer demolished him when they played last time, after a close match in their previous meeting.

I remember it being mentioned in commentary in their French Open clash this year that Kyle and Chardy were good mates who practised together.

Bob in Spain · Tennis legend

Coup Droit wrote:
Chardy has always stated, openly, that he does not believe in the 'you're as good as your weakest link' argument.

He says: forget about your weaknesses, just practice your weapons, and if your weapons are good enough, you'll never have to deal with your weaknesses because the match won't even get that far.

So for Chardy, it's serve and forehand and the rest can go hang

I'm not sure I quite buy off on it, but he's got a point.

Strangely enough, I have been thinking that the same approach for Kyle might not be such a bad idea. If his problem is just confidence and form, then maybe for the last couple of tournaments this year he should put the technical stuff to one side an just "rip-it", to use one of his favourite phrases.

In my younger days, I played a respectable level of amateur cricket as an opening batsman. As with every sportsman, I went though my fair share of poor runs of form - some would say more than my fair share. wink

Over time, I worked out the the best way to get back in to form was just to smash it. It didn't always work first time, but it only needed three of four to find the centre of the bat for the confidence to come flooding back. But equally as important for me, was that it also brought back the fun of just playing. I get the feeling recently that Kyle has lost this a bit this season and tennis has become more of a chore for him.

So my advice Kedders, is forget the technical side of things, forget the tactical planning and just let rip that forehand at every opportunity between now and the end of the year. If it works, great. If it doesn't, then you have the upcoming off-season to reassess. Nothing ventured, nothing gained in my opinion. But hey. What do I know.

Coup Droit · Tennis legend

A lot of wisdom in what you say there, Bob.

Certainly the French tennis coaches in the area I know always say to their players: if you get tight, and the match is slipping away, and you just seem to be making more and more mistakes, then just write off one game completely, and - as you say - just go smash the ball.
You loosen up your arm, you'll probably connect well with one or two, which at least will feel good, if you miss it doesn't matter because you were playing low odds anyway....
And often the match does turn.
And even if it doesn't, better to go down swinging than a painful, drip-drip capitulation.
And the same sometimes applies to a whole match when you're on a bad streak.

So, yes, Kyle certainly hasn't seemed happy on the court for a while. (Unlike Dan, for instance, against Isner - he lost but he really seemed to be enjoying the tussle). So, I agree - allez, Kyle, just go and have fun, and knock the fluff off the ball.

indiana · Tennis legend

Interesting thoughts.

If Kyle can't more self motivate he really does need a good 'motivator'.

Kyle has for much of his career looked to me not truly up for it like many but we got the refrain that that's just how he is and of course players very much differ. And last year did appear better in that regard ( coach Rosengren a large part in that? ) and with his results. And if results and progress come, naturally there will be less questioning.

But it is a step further from not really appearing up to looking down / unhappy. Body language can certainly transmit to your opponent and indeed yourself re playing looser. You are allowed to act and you might quite like the part.

Wonder how much a really good week would do for him, even quite a lucky good week. Would like to find out anyway.

-- Edited by indiana on Sunday 6th of October 2019 03:29:46 PM

Julia Carrot · All-time great

Cams the man this morning

JonH comes home · Tennis legend

Comfortable win, handily won by cam. Well done.