Weeks 22 & 23 - French Open, Paris - Clay

wolf · Tennis legend

Weeks 22 & 23 - French Open, Paris - Clay

Andy Parker · Strong Club Player

You are right that the old system meant that players did go through the motions in the first round just to pick up the pay cheque, but if a player is injured before the tournament starts and has not been playing for weeks, surely they shouldn't just enter and pull out at the last minute. That is still a really bad situation - maybe there should be some kind of money paid to direct entrants who have to withdraw pre-tournament before the qualifying takes place, to stop this kind of farce happening.

Even mid tournament, sometimes players make no attempt to win matches - I remember watching the magnificent doubles player Larissa Neiland (once Savchenko) very unexpectedly making the 3rd round at Wimbledon in the singles and literally going onto one of the park bench outside courts and making no attempt to win any points in the whole match, because she had clearly decided to concentrate on the doubles and didn't want to play in the singles as well. I was just about the only spectator for the whole sorry spectacle and it felt completely wrong, unprofessional and on the borderlines of cheating.

I reply again that it is a complete farce for an injured player to fly in with no hope of playing, be assessed by a tournament doctor and then leave with a big pay cheque, denying the next direct entrant pre-tournament, the right to actually gain entry by right for the tournament. If a player had a broken leg for instance, would it be OK for them to step off the plane, show the doctor the plaster cast and pick up the cheque - the whole thing feels ridiculous.

indiana · Tennis legend

To expand on my earlier thoughts, the mistake is indeed to so incentivise late late injury withdrawals as opposed to say all post MD entry list injury withdrawals. I find it difficult to really criticise any non absolute top flight player of any nation if they get injured fairly late on and then stretch withdrawing out past the current relevant date.

I think the Grand Slam Board have been too focused on just avoiding the R1 injury retitement farces ( still a good aim in itself and what we have is definitely better ) when a wider date interpretation could have avoided these late issues, rewarded all who made the MD entry list ( maybe not PR entrants who withdraw but if direct entrants on ranking ), and avoided denying next in line replacement MD entrants by the withdrawal being after qualifying starts. And it would save these moral dillemmas and judgements.

Coup Droit · Tennis legend

Just my own view, but I do not have real moral problems with Katie B just turning up to collect a £20k pay cheque (if that's what's she done). It's really hard to make a living, another player will get a chance of the match, you're not taking away a slot (just an automatic slot)...

To me, that's way less morally dubious than Kyle moving to the Bahamas to avoid paying tax here (especially when tax rates are relatively low).

Julia Carrot · All-time great

Is it possible Katie Boulter would have been in Oxted, Surrey Yesterday? I walked past someone tall, blonde, Head racquet over shoulder and other kit, very professional looking and out of place on the high street. My immediate thought was Katie, but then I thought no, shes injured, not playing. But now she has appeared in this draw ?

Ace Ventura · Tennis legend

Coup Droit wrote:
Just my own view, but I do not have real moral problems with Katie B just turning up to collect a £20k pay cheque (if that's what's she done). It's really hard to make a living, another player will get a chance of the match, you're not taking away a slot (just an automatic slot)...

To me, that's way less morally dubious than Kyle moving to the Bahamas to avoid paying tax here (especially when tax rates are relatively low).

It's a difficult one. 20k to that level of player is absolutely huge. Katie might be a little bit better off than the standard circa top 100 player being a leading light for a big tennis nation and possibly more likely to gain from marketing / endorsement opportunities, but very few will be in a position to walk away from that sort of money if they can receive it just for potentially turning up and withdrawing, so you can't blame them, if that's what she has done. Giorgi is in a similar boat - she's not played since Miami and was always very likely to miss this and pulled out yesterday, just before the draw, but after the deadline where she could collect her cheque, and had she pulled out even on Sunday before qualifying, someone else would have gone into the main draw directly and someone further down the pecking order would have got a chance to enter qualifying. Now a LL spot will open up instead, so someone is getting a second chance rather than someone further down the line getting a chance at all, which isn't as good IMO.

It is far better than seeing all those retirements in R1 at either the French or Wimbledon the other year, before they changed the rule, but it would be better still if as soon as the main draw initial entry is out, you could withdraw whenever you wanted and pick up the half cheque you have earned for being ranked high enough and there'd be less LL's in the draw, even if that is better than a non contest early retirement.

-- Edited by Ace Ventura on Friday 24th of May 2019 10:29:48 AM

Ace Ventura · Tennis legend

Julia Carrot wrote:
Is it possible Katie Boulter would have been in Oxted, Surrey Yesterday? I walked past someone tall, blonde, Head racquet over shoulder and other kit, very professional looking and out of place on the high street. My immediate thought was Katie, but then I thought no, shes injured, not playing. But now she has appeared in this draw ?

There's no real clue on her Instagram, but there is a story video yesterday of her in a fitness centre doing some kind of sit up stretch thing and it looks like Harriet in in the video in the background and she has been at the National Tennis Centre this week, so it's probably there.

Imagine after all this chat on here, she turns up in Paris and routines Vekic in R1 biggrin

the addict · Tennis legend

Mike Dickson and Stuart Fraser have both just reported that Katie has withdrawn with a back injury.

Ace Ventura · Tennis legend

Well that's official then.

Had Giorgi and Boulter withdrawn 5 days ago (and not been eligible for their cheques) then it would have been Pera and Voegele in the main draw with Anna Bondar and Barbara Hass in qualifying (although Haas did pull out of her last event, so may be injured, in which case Ruse would have got in). As it is, Voegele is out and Pera is 2-3* in her FQR, and 2 LL spots will open up rather than the likes of Bondar/Ruse/Haas getting a chance, but it is a dog eat dog world. It's better than seeing Vekic d. Boulter 6-1 ret. or xxx d. Giorgi 5-3 ret, in the main draw, but still not ideal.

Andy Parker · Strong Club Player

Reflecting on my somewhat OTT outraged comments earlier, like others say, I can't really blame a player for picking up a £20k cheque for free, but the system clearly needs changing. At least there is now an end to this, and as a massive fan of Katie B, who I regard as our brightest young prospect, I now really hope that she can get herself fully fit for Wimbledon, where she could do really well.

brendan · Strong Club Player

The money for having originally been in the draw is reward for the hard work of having been high enough in the rankings to have made the draw. If those who missed out feel aggrieved then they should have worked harder to get themself in the same position of earning a place in the draw by right.

Coup Droit · Tennis legend

Can't help but feel that Katie would have been a lot better advised not to tweet anything. She's getting an enormous amount of stick now. As said, I don't really have a problem, and neither do many others, as per brendan above. But it seems to be taking the Mick to pretend otherwise. Should have just kept schtummm.

Katie Boulter

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So disappointed to have to pull out of the French Open. I was still hoping to have a chance of competing but doctors have advised me not to take a risk with my back. Cant wait to get back on court soon.

4:11 AM - 24 May 2019

Ace Ventura · Tennis legend

Jo gets Lottner. Happy enough with that.

I mean it could have been a bit easier, but I think the main aim was to avoid Pera, which she has done. Lottner has played a lot of clay matches this year and does have some decent wins, but she is almost 23, never been higher ranked than 128 (currently 149) and has benefited from a lot of wildcards throughout her career.

-- Edited by Ace Ventura on Friday 24th of May 2019 04:44:27 PM

Peter too · Tennis legend

R128: KONTA, Johanna (GBR) 26 26 v LOTTNER, Antonia (GER) Q 149 CH=128 25/6/18

-- Edited by Peter too on Friday 24th of May 2019 05:50:53 PM

Coup Droit · Tennis legend

Lottner wasn't that amazing against Elsa J. And o saw a bit of her versus Georgina P G and she was decent but hardly scary.