So outside of Norrie, Evo and Edmund, the men of British tennis have been poor this year.
Ward-done nothing really this year, but nothing was really expected
Clarke- very disappointing, may now potentially face a challenger level career and never be an atp player
Choinski- the new Brydan Klien, often makes challenger QF but nothing more, has maintained his ranking
Broady-I fear for his future after this year
Draper- victim of the tour change, and has since done nothing
Hoyt- plays on Disney land tour, so unknown how he is doing
Certainly agree with you on some of that. Jay hasn't had the start to the season that he wants, but sometimes players plateau for a period of time while they find their feet at a new level. The route to the top is never a straight line.
I think there have been some injury issues for Jack D but I agree totally that the tour change has had a negative affect.
As for Evan, given his long term injury problems in the past, he needed to just get a lot of tennis under his belt which he has certainly done in the early part of this year. It will be good to see how he gets on when he hits the Challenger tour in a few weeks.
But overall, there I weeks when I struggle to find anyone to follow given the lack of success we have had. I hasn't been a great year so far.
I've actually just recently written in the Strongest Nation thread that Andy could well be back up to ranked GB #4 by the end of May, without playing so still outside the top 200.
I personally certainly won't call the other individual players "garbage", many giving of their best, some with hurdles known and unknown, some off form, some nearer their own best. But there will be legitimate views and perhaps abjectives about the overall situation, and I do very much wish there was a heck of a lot more depth and more sign of other players even threatening to break through.
We have but 9 players even with any ATP ranking points so far this year and one is Andy. If you are doing the season ending predictions, as things stand Jack Findel-Hawkins would be #10 from the point he has from last year.
Hopefully at least Jack Draper can get his year going and Jay Clarke push forward again. But for now these are hopes and beyond them?
Still think that's harsh on Choinski. Yes, he might not reach the top 100 (or anywhere close) and if he does, he'll have to beat the level of opposition I'm about to list, but some of the opponents he has lost to since 'turning British' are:
Wolf - beat Evans not long ago Dustin Brown - inconsistent - won a challenger the other day, beating former recent top 30 player (even if overranked due to Paris run) Krajinovic in the final (2 TBs and Jan with 3 more games won) Opelka - circa top 50 with a big game (Jan took a set) Bublik - beat Evans the other week and can be very good on his day
These are decent players. Yes, if he is going to push on he will have to win more of these type matches than lose, but we are entering clay challengers which seem to be his best surface so let's see what he can do over the next couple of months before the grass.
-- Edited by Ace Ventura on Monday 8th of April 2019 05:12:00 PM
I wonder if psychologically the changes on the tour have affected a lot of players between ITF and challenger level. In both mens and womens we are struggling at the moment. Watson, The Broadys, Ward, Clarke, Dunne, Taylor and a lot of the more promising juniors as well. I know we could argue its not just British players, but some countries are certainly being affected more than others.
The players Ive listed above be interesting to ask them that question compared to say this time last year. From a well being point of view its even more worrying I think, and thats certainly more important as well.
-- Edited by Jaggy1876 on Monday 8th of April 2019 07:29:45 PM
I wonder if psychologically the changes on the tour have affected a lot of players between ITF and challenger level. In both mens and womens we are struggling at the moment. Watson, The Broadys, Ward, Clarke, Dunne, Taylor and a lot of the more promising juniors as well. I know we could argue its not just British players, but some countries are certainly being affected more than others.
The players Ive listed above be interesting to ask them that question compared to say this time last year. From a well being point of view its even more worrying I think, and thats certainly more important as well.
-- Edited by Jaggy1876 on Monday 8th of April 2019 07:29:45 PM
From a women's ITF POV, I don't really know how / why these changes will have affected them. Naomi has only 6 match wins since May (well before the changes) and even 2 of those have come since January, so she's just generally bang out of form / on the decline. Likewise Watson, she's been well out of form for a while, bar a bit of a revival at Vancouver, US Open and Quebec, she's been going out in the first round of pretty much every event for around 18 months.
Katy and Gabi have been seeds in a lot of their matches and since the turn of the year have generally been losing to the players this year that they would have beaten / competing better with last year. Maybe the less spaces in draws have made them plan differently, but they have generally been to Australia and Japan where they often go, and have made main draws, often seeds as I say, so I don't really think we can blame them.
Maybe some lower down the pyramid like Tara, Barnett, Freya etc. who aren't guaranteed to play where they want, but not so much for the 4 women you have specifically referenced.
Yes Ace, I'd agree with you re the women. To me with our women it is indeed players lower down the pecking order that have real issues with the new system such as multiple entries and uncertainty re often any sort of schedule. With women's 25Ks and above still getting WTA points and the above players still able to play fairly normal schedules ( and as you say often seeded ) I think it is really just down to them, their support and their form.
But yes re players borderline 25K and below. And while yes it really effects players generally across the globe, the LTA don't help with no 15Ks and the relative amount of 25Ks. Though guess quite a lot of players from other nations are in no better and probably worse position re home tournaments.
Re the men mentioned, James and Jay have been able to continue to play challengers and just basically haven't got the results so far this year to push on. Jan Choinski gets his opportunities too. So I don't see much real effect on them. Liam has been out of form for some time, certainly well back into last year, and again knowing only what he has divulged all the best to him. Though true the system may not help a recovery from further falls.
Again with the men, it is further down that is more of an issue with players trying to progress from 15K/25K ITFs to challengers. Maybe especially some up and coming ones like Jack Draper and that the new system was claimed would help, though Jack has separately been held back by some injury issues. So promising juniors, potentially much moreso ( though time will provide more clarity ) but not the other players specifically mentioned. Other bit older players like Lloyd and Evan maybe, though the jury is out to how much overall such as they are being held back from their true potential. It will be interesting to see Evan in upcoming challengers that it seems he may get into.
So in general I see the new system as mostly a real concern for men who are below being generally able to play at least challengers or above and women who are below being generally able to play 25Ks or above ( ie. not these still pretty much as was playing in the main ranking system tournaments ). Or borderline to these and trying to push on.
Bah, I could probably have just pretty much said that previous paragraph plus up and comers and maybe recoverers like Laura and Mandy.
-- Edited by indiana on Monday 8th of April 2019 08:55:05 PM
Odd. I think that I would have gone for "other than".
... but I wouldn't have written the headline, good English grammar or not.
Equally correct, Chris, but a matter of personal choice, I think. It all depends on what's known in the trade as your idiolect, your own specific (& unique) way of using language.
Only Vandenburg could have come up with a deliberately provocative subject line like that!
Agreed it hasn't been a great start for many, but Jay is still only 20, let's not forget. And Jack has barely played this year partly through injury.
Fair comment re Jack so difficult to do a lot more than "nothing". And re Jay I'd say his start to the year being "very disappointing" is very arguable. Not really pushing on as yet but not that bad either - his current race position, just outside the top 200, is very similar to his ranking. And yes what then follows for a 20 yo based on a few months, even if agreeing that it was so poor, is far too much much to be based on a few months.
I agreed that there is certainly a general men's position beyond our current top 3 ranked to be pretty concerned about, it's not good. But here and just in general I individualise less than some, mainly because there can be background that I am unaware of and anyway to slate to not much purpose individuals is not what I come here for.
With our more leading players such as Andy, Kyle and Jo I think it is more reasonable to analyse and question any downs and I've certainly gone there. Down the food chain a bit then rather less so, except for the more obvious, and often less than encouraging if some players still drop in here from time to time.
Agreed it hasn't been a great start for many, but Jay is still only 20, let's not forget. And Jack has barely played this year partly through injury.
Fair comment re Jack so difficult to do a lot more than "nothing". And re Jay I'd say his start to the year being "very disappointing" is very arguable. Not really pushing on as yet but not that bad either - his current race position, just outside the top 200, is very similar to his ranking. And yes what then follows for a 20 yo based on a few months, even if agreeing that it was so poor, is far too much much to be based on a few months.
I agreed that there is certainly a general men's position beyond our current top 3 ranked to be pretty concerned about, it's not good. But here and just in general I individualise less than some, mainly because there can be background that I am unaware of and anyway to slate to not much purpose individuals is not what I come here for.
With our more leading players such as Andy, Kyle and Jo I think it is more reasonable to analyse and question any downs and I've certainly gone there. Down the food chain a bit then rather less so, except for the more obvious, and often less than encouraging if some players still drop in here from time to time.
This is something I am always very conscious of when posting on here.
