Mark1968 wrote:

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With regards the above Evans / Murray comments I can see the arguments on both sides. One thing that bugs me about Jamie, a man I have always liked, is that he often talks as though he is a superstar which he is not. Brother Andy has stated on several occasions that the LTA ruined Jamie's game as a youngster which may be the case but Jamie needs to remember that he failed drastically as a singles player.

Even though vastly improved now, from say 10 years ago, doubles has saved him from the tennis dole. On balance I think Jamie should be happy with his lot.

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 Im in agreement with the above to be honest and also Dan is spot on. The only thing Id counter is its perhaps not down to failing to apply themselves in most cases and rather that doubles players generally arent good enough for singles. So any celebration of how many top 100 players we have is in fact a celebration of failure. So Dan is spot on and Jamie will just need to suck it, hard working and nice guy that he undoubtably is.

Im only in this thread because I assumed this would be the right place to debate it.

Just to be clear, I have no criticism of the players at all. Luke B, Joe S, Jonnie O all gave singles a whirl and it didn't work. Some of the others never really tried singles at all. And they've all been very successful at doubles, made money, played in top tournaments - all credit to them - it was almost certainly the right decision.

My criticism is with Jamie saying more credit should be given to them and the LTA should focus more on their achievements and promote a doubles specialist to lead tennis performance overall.

Doubles is like wheelchair tennis, or junior tennis, or senior tennis. It is a separate branch of the main sport which receives very little media and public attention, presumably because very few people (in the big scheme of things) are interested. If the federation wishes to fund them for reasons of inclusiveness or trying to broaden the appeal or whatever, then OK. But the global grandstand sport is singles. And the LTA's failure at that is what matters.

Jamie and Bruno had to save three match points at *4-5 0-40 and Krawietz missed two pretty easy shots on the first two.

Yes, bad two double faults by Ram, the first one missed by a mile and that got in his mind for the second one. And a really bad missed smash by him in the game they got broken in the 3rd. But I think that is out of character for him and I think he is an excellent partner for Joe.

christ wrote:

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I think Mr Murray (J) should have avoided descending to the level of calling Mr. Evans (the current British number 3 singles player) "someone who really hasn't applied himself as much as he should", following up with "He has made a hash of his career with his decision-making and stuff,". Not very edifying, even if true.

 

Edit: It also appears that he has more ambition for Mr Cayer than Mr Cayer has for himself.

-- Edited by christ on Monday 21st of January 2019 01:24:10 PM

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 Evans is bang on the money with this.  Doubles tennis is a utter joke, I would go as far to say that we should ban it from this forum.  Some of the people on here that set up a seperate doubles thread for every tourn......

It is also sad, as doubles used to be very good, in the 80s when the top players used to play.  The problem is that, the players that now play doubles are not the best at it.  When we see davis cup or Olympics, and the top singles players have to play doubles, they are so much better than the supposed top ranked doubles players in the world.  So what we have is a sub-standard sport, with substandard players. Is like Marcus Willis playing that touch tennis.

Be under no illusion, doubles players, if they were good enough would play singles, a bit like Mahut, Lodra Mirnyi, but the vast majority of them are single failures. 

An interesting thread, and a little damning of doubles which I think most of us enjoy whilst not considering it an equal. But what about Ladies? They receive equal billing at the slams and of course equal prize money. I agree with this I hasten to add but you cannot argue its at the same level as the mens game.....we do not have the one singles draw, we require separate ones. I am only musing here, not trying to light the blue touch paper. But a lot the arguments for playing down doubles could apply to the ladies, and a lot of the arguments for talking up ladies could apply to doubles or perhaps those better versed than me could point out the error of my ways?

A couple of things. It is physically obvious why we have separate men's and women's competitions. And they are separate and different competitions to be appreciated and preferred as folk see fit. Who are better tennis players ( if all played together ) is absolutely clear and irrelevant. How much their game comparatively appeals in Slams and deserves equal pay there is of course a historic argument but a different argument. But clearly women's tennis appeals far far above their comparative ability to compete against men.

The top ranked women singles players are the best women tennis players. The top ranked men's doubles players are generally far from being the best men tennis players, including probably top doubles players if doubles was what everyone played. They almost all have given up on their original aim of singles and we are watching players compete in their backup choice ( and for some it clearly fits their skillset ), enjoyable as for me it often is and as much as I disagree with some comments made at times against doubles.

-- Edited by indiana on Monday 21st of January 2019 03:30:27 PM

Wait, hang on, it wasn't Jamie that started this was it? He may have got a bit riled when Dan said "So we are celebrating people who didn't make it at singles and people who didn't have the attitude to work hard enough to make it in the singles game."

Which coming from Evo who has wasted long periods of his career is a bit rich, and Jamie has pointed out as such.