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junior · Intermediate Club Player

The LTA

indiana · Tennis legend

junior wrote:
Bet he beats Jonathan Spanktheballout every match

No, you are still thinking of Jonathan from his junior days. He progressed a lot with good coaching and I see goes by a new name these days, Jonathan Hardaninnow. He should see off Patitback.

JonH comes home · Tennis legend

I played a junior event locally when i was around 15 or so - thought I was the big I am , had all the style, attacking player, serve and volley (when players used to do that). Played Cuthbert Patitback in the opening round. My name is Jonathan...

I got trounced. I couldnt get the ball through him, would constantly be missing, the more I pressed, the more I made mistakes, the more frustrated I got, racket flying into the netting, swearing, terrrible behaviour. Lost something like 2 and 2; demoralising.

Putitback went onto the reach the semis I recall, leaving a trail of players like me with no rackets left in their kitbag and disgusted parents questionning how they had wasted a weekend as little Jonny embarrassed them immensely

indiana · Tennis legend

JonH comes home wrote:
I played a junior event locally when i was around 15 or so - thought I was the big I am , had all the style, attacking player, serve and volley (when players used to do that). Played Cuthbert Patitback in the opening round. My name is Jonathan...

I got trounced. I couldnt get the ball through him, would constantly be missing, the more I pressed, the more I made mistakes, the more frustrated I got, racket flying into the netting, swearing, terrrible behaviour. Lost something like 2 and 2; demoralising.

Putitback went onto the reach the semis I recall, leaving a trail of players like me with no rackets left in their kitbag and disgusted parents questionning how they had wasted a weekend as little Jonny embarrassed them immensely

I bet you're glad you stuck with it, Mr Hardaninnow.

JonH comes home · Tennis legend

indiana wrote:
JonH comes home wrote:
I played a junior event locally when i was around 15 or so - thought I was the big I am , had all the style, attacking player, serve and volley (when players used to do that). Played Cuthbert Patitback in the opening round. My name is Jonathan...

I got trounced. I couldnt get the ball through him, would constantly be missing, the more I pressed, the more I made mistakes, the more frustrated I got, racket flying into the netting, swearing, terrrible behaviour. Lost something like 2 and 2; demoralising.

Putitback went onto the reach the semis I recall, leaving a trail of players like me with no rackets left in their kitbag and disgusted parents questionning how they had wasted a weekend as little Jonny embarrassed them immensely
I bet you're glad you stuck with it, Mr Hardaninnow.

biggrin

Coup Droit · Tennis legend

JonH comes home wrote:
I played a junior event locally when i was around 15 or so - thought I was the big I am , had all the style, attacking player, serve and volley (when players used to do that). Played Cuthbert Patitback in the opening round. My name is Jonathan...

I got trounced. I couldnt get the ball through him, would constantly be missing, the more I pressed, the more I made mistakes, the more frustrated I got, racket flying into the netting, swearing, terrrible behaviour. Lost something like 2 and 2; demoralising.

Putitback went onto the reach the semis I recall, leaving a trail of players like me with no rackets left in their kitbag and disgusted parents questionning how they had wasted a weekend as little Jonny embarrassed them immensely

Melanie South gave a very interview, saying the same thing.

How she got trounced in every juniors match, being Miss MelSpankitout by little Missie Putitback.

BUT at age 20, Mel was playing pro tennis and little missie was nowhere to be seen

Coup Droit · Tennis legend

indiana wrote:
JonH comes home wrote:
I played a junior event locally when i was around 15 or so - thought I was the big I am , had all the style, attacking player, serve and volley (when players used to do that). Played Cuthbert Patitback in the opening round. My name is Jonathan...

I got trounced. I couldnt get the ball through him, would constantly be missing, the more I pressed, the more I made mistakes, the more frustrated I got, racket flying into the netting, swearing, terrrible behaviour. Lost something like 2 and 2; demoralising.

Putitback went onto the reach the semis I recall, leaving a trail of players like me with no rackets left in their kitbag and disgusted parents questionning how they had wasted a weekend as little Jonny embarrassed them immensely
I bet you're glad you stuck with it, Mr Hardaninnow.

biggrin biggrin biggrin

junior · Intermediate Club Player

Make the ball in at a very young age, over trying to spank winners which players biomechanically won't be able to do. Although even I surprised by some top ATP/WTA players ability to do only this (Ramos, Simon, Errani). I do like Melanie South (not sure she ever cracked the top 150), your argument is relatively weak Coup, as any point in women's tennis that goes above 4 shots without one of them spanking it out with seemingly little reason, seems a miracle at times.

Indy, need to take a stroll down yorn local tennis club and watch a tournament one day, then you'll see how many hititinandhard now, very few and then they're still unable to play matches mentally, especially if spanking balls hasnt immediately won the match for them in the first two games. Then they become Charlie loseemotionalcontrolgetangryandtank.

junior · Intermediate Club Player

If anyone (Coup and Indy) would like an example of this, there's an interview with Rafa from Rome somewhere from about 2010/2011 the year I think that Lord Gulbis beat Federer in quarters then lost to Rafa in semis. I believe that Lord Gulbis's words were "he was dominating the match" and hence for that he was the better player and should have won the match. Which Rafa responded if "hitting the ball hard and out is dominating the match then why did he lose?". Is a funny tennis moment I would recommend looking it up

-- Edited by junior on Friday 5th of February 2021 01:21:50 PM

indiana · Tennis legend

Mel South spent a year in the top 150, from July 2008 to July 2009, almost half that time inside the top 120, plus other top 150 weeks later in 2009. And for one week cracked the top 100, WR 99 on 02/02/09.

That some players, including say Gulbis, never properly develop hitting it hard and in does not mean that the hit it hard and get more consistently in strategy won't work for other players.

I don't think you are quite grasping ( or appearing not to ) that no-one is saying that hittiing it hard and out is a winning strategy, and I am sure folk could name plenty more players that have suffered from the obvious fact that it isn't.

But rather suggesting that it can be an initial period ( a development period when results matter comparatively little compared to later ) towards the aim of consistently hitting it hard and in.

-- Edited by indiana on Friday 5th of February 2021 01:52:59 PM

junior · Intermediate Club Player

I'm happy to hear this, from as much as I knew her when I was but a little sprout she was a lovely girl and definitely deserved it. I'll attach the link to the Nadal/Gulbis video for you Indy, some wise words from Rafael Patitback

youtu.be/CreLHR2DZvM

indiana · Tennis legend

I have never really thought of Rafa as a "pat" it back

JonH comes home · Tennis legend

junior wrote:
Make the ball in at a very young age, over trying to spank winners which players biomechanically won't be able to do. Although even I surprised by some top ATP/WTA players ability to do only this (Ramos, Simon, Errani). I do like Melanie South (not sure she ever cracked the top 150), your argument is relatively weak Coup, as any point in women's tennis that goes above 4 shots without one of them spanking it out with seemingly little reason, seems a miracle at times.

Indy, need to take a stroll down yorn local tennis club and watch a tournament one day, then you'll see how many hititinandhard now, very few and then they're still unable to play matches mentally, especially if spanking balls hasnt immediately won the match for them in the first two games. Then they become Charlie loseemotionalcontrolgetangryandtank.

oh yes!

Many a career lost on this. the great thing about Johnny McEnroe and Jimbo Connors was they did they get angry but it was always controlled and knowing and never with a tank associated - maybe once in the Davis Cup final in Gothenberg in 1984 and French Open final versus Lendl did Mac go the full way - whatever his behaviour, he generally had complete control of when to stop it; noticeably he never lost it v Borg!

junior · Intermediate Club Player

Many believe it was done to distract the opponent more than anything when things weren't going his way, it's understandable then why he wouldn't do it against the Iceman. Few tankers left on tour (Kyrgios,Tomic) as psychology has become such a massive part of tennis, a lot of Rafa's work is done for him before even going on court, an unpassable unbreakable wall up the other end who will give you nothing, imagine expecting to beat him with this whole play unpredictably and hit the ball hard and out mentality, Shapalov and Kyrgios come to mind as having got a little bit lucky one time, but have been crushed pretty much every time since.

JonH comes home · Tennis legend

junior wrote:
Many believe it was done to distract the opponent more than anything when things weren't going his way, it's understandable then why he wouldn't do it against the Iceman. Few tankers left on tour (Kyrgios,Tomic) as psychology has become such a massive part of tennis, a lot of Rafa's work is done for him before even going on court, an unpassable unbreakable wall up the other end who will give you nothing, imagine expecting to beat him with this whole play unpredictably and hit the ball hard and out mentality, Shapalov and Kyrgios come to mind as having got a little bit lucky one time, but have been crushed pretty much every time since.

the French players as a whole seem to fit the mould of talented, mercurial, technically gifted but lacking in real strength of mentality and never , therefore, realising their potential as a national group. I am being hard to the French, who I love, and it is a stereotype. But then, arent all stereotypes based on some basic truth?