Week 14 - Challenger (€42,500+H) - Napoli, Italy (red clay)

Jaffa · Challenger level

Week 14 - Challenger (€42,500+H) - Napoli, Italy (red clay)

indiana · Tennis legend

The Optimist wrote:
Hmmm.....hitting anyone, official, player or spectator with a ball outside of play is a strict default offence and usually treated as one, regardless of intent. However, I would question whether it was really outside of play. The fault was called as the return was on its way back and he was already shaping up for his next shot which he hit but without full intensity. You see all players do that multiple times in every set. Unfortunate that it caught the opponent on the back of the head causing temporary loss of balance. I suppose he should have been looking where he was hitting it as he knew by that time it was not a live shot.

Pretty much agree with all of that.

It was certainly not unnatural to play the further shot as he did and to me it wasn't really in anger just a bit frustration and it wasn't that hard. Yes, he should have been more careful, but in my view the punishment does not fit the 'crime'.

While accepting it was perhaps not unnatural to go over it did look a slightly comical delayed fall by Junaid to a less than vicious strike, but one has to accept that that's how it effected him.

I am not surprised at all at the default, but maybe tennis does need to examine the apparent "hitting anyone, official, player or spectator with a ball outside of play is a strict default offense and usually treated as such".

It seems to be generally enforced so strongly it's as if the authorities are worried about anarchy breaking out if they aren't seen to be strong on such matters. That I very much doubt and they should still be able to differentiate between real anger and / or intent and 'oops' matters.

The Ostapenko incident with the ball boy against Broady to my mind was an 'oops' unexpected outcome of a minorly frustrated toss of the racket to the side, and common sense to my mind prevailed then. This one was also 'oops' and while I more understood the default, maybe the authorities should have a bit of a rethink and keep tennis players on court playing tennis with just a penalty point or whatever.

'Oops' may be a talking point, it shouldn't be a default. Let Junaid pick himself up, properly recover and then play. Results of proper anger and/or OTT reaction, and we've seen a few, different matter. But too often we hear "but they hit X" at whatever speed when there was clearly no intent whatever.

If he was actually concussed and / or unable to continue ( it was unclear here other than he stayed down ) then I guess default win to Junaid & Skupski, but I'd still have some sympathy in this case.

-- Edited by indiana on Friday 8th of April 2016 11:57:09 AM

Stircrazy · Tennis legend

And now there are no seeded pairs left in the draw:

SF: Gero Kretschmer & Alexander Satschko (GER/GER) CR 197 (98+99) defeated (2) Rameez Junaid (AUS) & Ken Skupski CR 149 (72+77) by 6-0 3-6 [10-8] cry

Oakland2002 · All-time great

I am a firm believer in the rules adopted by the college cricket team I played for, no player on the team was allowed to show pain (if they did they were fined heavily) to avoid a fine they also had to say thank you to the opponent inflicting the pain.

It worked pretty well very few interruptions to play and plenty of fun afterwards in the bar. To be frank certain athletes go to ground far too easily!

TMH · Futures qualifying

indiana wrote:
The Optimist wrote:
Hmmm.....hitting anyone, official, player or spectator with a ball outside of play is a strict default offence and usually treated as one, regardless of intent. However, I would question whether it was really outside of play. The fault was called as the return was on its way back and he was already shaping up for his next shot which he hit but without full intensity. You see all players do that multiple times in every set. Unfortunate that it caught the opponent on the back of the head causing temporary loss of balance. I suppose he should have been looking where he was hitting it as he knew by that time it was not a live shot.

Pretty much agree with all of that.
It was certainly not unnatural to play the further shot as he did and to me it wasn't really in anger just a bit frustration and it wasn't that hard. Yes, he should have been more careful, but in my view the punishment does not fit the 'crime'.
While accepting it was perhaps not unnatural to go over it did look a slightly comical delayed fall by Junaid to a less than vicious strike, but one has to accept that that's how it effected him.
I am not surprised at all at the default, but maybe tennis does need to examine the apparent "hitting anyone, official, player or spectator with a ball outside of play is a strict default offense and usually treated as such".
It seems to be generally enforced so strongly it's as if the authorities are worried about anarchy breaking out if they aren't seen to be strong on such matters. That I very much doubt and they should still be able to differentiate between real anger and / or intent and 'oops' matters.
The Ostapenko incident with the ball boy against Broady to my mind was an 'oops' unexpected outcome of a minorly frustrated toss of the racket to the side, and common sense to my mind prevailed then. This one was also 'oops' and while I more understood the default, maybe the authorities should have a bit of a rethink and keep tennis players on court playing tennis with just a penalty point or whatever.
'Oops' may be a talking point, it shouldn't be a default. Let Junaid pick himself up, properly recover and then play. Results of proper anger and/or OTT reaction, and we've seen a few, different matter. But too often we hear "but they hit X" at whatever speed when there was clearly no intent whatever.
If he was actually concussed and / or unable to continue ( it was unclear here other than he stayed down ) then I guess default win to Junaid & Skupski, but I'd still have some sympathy in this case.

-- Edited by indiana on Friday 8th of April 2016 11:57:09 AM

Agree with this. Unnecessary reaction from Junaid and very unjust punishment.

Umpires in tennis do tend to follow a no-nonsense, no-common sense approach to rules and it's a detriment to the sport.