Marcus Willis

ROSAMUND · Futures level

RE: Marcus Willis

ROSAMUND · Futures level

In his interview Marcus makes the point that there was too much of putting you with a coach they (the LTA) decided on. There are world class coaches at the LTA and in the UK but it has to work with the player.

indiana · Tennis legend

Could/should have managed to do so very much more in the game with his talent and personality. Huge pity.

Coup Droit · Tennis legend

ROSAMUND wrote:
In his interview Marcus makes the point that there was too much of putting you with a coach they (the LTA) decided on. There are world class coaches at the LTA and in the UK but it has to work with the player.

Most federations have the same problem. They have certain coaches on their payroll and you have to use them, or else what would they do???

Paying the players directly to fund their own choice of coach is more expensive, and loses all the collective benefits of a federation.

Big tennis playing countries (like France, say) have a benefit simply in that there are more coaches, coz more players, etc. and so the better players basically have a bigger choice of federation coaches. But quite a few still can't find one that gels.

And, yes, Indy - wish Marcus well and bet he has lots of good memories but he could have achieved so much more.

JonH comes home · Tennis legend

the thing he regrets most is never winning a British Tennis Active Board Player of the Month Award. It was in the Mike Dickson interview but they seem to have edited it out now...

At least I think he said that...

Madadman · Top national player

Understand Marcus' point re coaches the LTA assigned. Since I have been following the sport in more depth than just following the top level. There seems to be too many changes that no process is ever given a long enough time to see if it works.
However the ATP as well have made things a lot harder during that time. The ATP 250's qualifying draws that used to 32. This allowed players to 'give it a go' many players in the top 500 or so could get in to a few draws a year. The challenger circuit has been messed around a few times. They also use to have 32 qualifying draws and at one point dropping to 4 men draws. Reduced ATP points at ITF level, 10 points for an M15 win compared to 18 before that kerfuffle. There are not many M25s around or the Challenger 50's so there is a big gap between the M15's and when you get to Challenger 80 level. Considering you need to be at least top 500 if not top 400 to make a challenger qualifying draw a lot of times that's the equivalent of 10 M15 titles in ranking points. Arguably making it harder to rise the rankings means only the best reach the top which should be the case but does seem the ATP's attempt to reduce players chances of sneaking through have worked.

I'd be interested to see the potential growth of the UTR tournaments in coming years as they do appear to offer players a better chance of playing tennis/making money than the ATP circuit.

Coup Droit · Tennis legend

JonH comes home wrote:
the thing he regrets most is never winning a British Tennis Active Board Player of the Month Award. It was in the Mike Dickson interview but they seem to have edited it out now...

At least I think he said that...

biggrin

Still a chance - never say never - I rather like voting for the rank outsider or the 'feel good' story - c'mon, Marcus - organise a Builders' Tennis Bash, and I'll vote for you !

Jan · Hall of fame

Maybe there should be a vote for "Best player never to have won PoM".........

emmsie69 · ATP level

Madadman wrote:
Understand Marcus' point re coaches the LTA assigned. Since I have been following the sport in more depth than just following the top level. There seems to be too many changes that no process is ever given a long enough time to see if it works.
However the ATP as well have made things a lot harder during that time. The ATP 250's qualifying draws that used to 32. This allowed players to 'give it a go' many players in the top 500 or so could get in to a few draws a year. The challenger circuit has been messed around a few times. They also use to have 32 qualifying draws and at one point dropping to 4 men draws. Reduced ATP points at ITF level, 10 points for an M15 win compared to 18 before that kerfuffle. There are not many M25s around or the Challenger 50's so there is a big gap between the M15's and when you get to Challenger 80 level. Considering you need to be at least top 500 if not top 400 to make a challenger qualifying draw a lot of times that's the equivalent of 10 M15 titles in ranking points. Arguably making it harder to rise the rankings means only the best reach the top which should be the case but does seem the ATP's attempt to reduce players chances of sneaking through have worked.

I'd be interested to see the potential growth of the UTR tournaments in coming years as they do appear to offer players a better chance of playing tennis/making money than the ATP circuit.

I think the elephant in the room is the points not dropping off. Theoretically the points on offer at the lower levels wouldn't be such an issue in usual times as it would be the same for everyone. The points required to get into the top 500 for men is 72, for women it's 85 and surprisingly the gap doesn't widen massively even with 50 points on offer at WTA as opposed to 20 for the men. Whats causing a problem is players still having points from 2 years ago. It makes it so much harder for a player to go up the rankings. I really think that any points a year old should be worth 50% now and a tappering off over the next few months.

ROSAMUND · Futures level

Years ago in the 1980's, (I think) full ranking points for the WTA only used to last for 6 months and then dropped to 50%.. There was also ranking points for beating players so if you beat the World No 1 it was recognised with ranking points.

-- Edited by ROSAMUND on Thursday 4th of March 2021 02:19:05 PM

indiana · Tennis legend

And now for a period the ATP are planning on allowing players to keep 50% of points earned more than 2 years ago!

ROSAMUND · Futures level

indiana wrote:
And now for a period the ATP are planning on allowing players to keep 50% of points earned more than 2 years ago!

I think snooker has ranking points over 2 years but it's a completely different sport.

JonH comes home · Tennis legend

ROSAMUND wrote:
indiana wrote:
And now for a period the ATP are planning on allowing players to keep 50% of points earned more than 2 years ago!
I think snooker has ranking points over 2 years but it's a completely different sport.

Darts also had or has 2 year rankings - mind you they have, like snooker, all sorts of orders of merit linked to different tournament qualifications.

Yes - ATP used to also have a "quality" aspect ie additional ranking points for beating #1, 2-5, 6-10, 11-20, 21-50, 51-100 etc etc which worked quite well at the time when players abilities where clearly different in those bands - they got rid of it as players abilities became much more uniform across the piece, if I recall ie beating WR 80 was really not much different than WR 30, say...

Coup Droit · Tennis legend

From Matt Smith (tennis coach)

Matt Smith
@smithy_red
·
2h
It was a real privilege to be a small part of this man's journey.

A stand up guy in every way, I'm looking forward to working together again in a different arena.

Unfortunately another in a long list of severely mismanaged talent in Britain.

Oakland2002 · All-time great

Marcus is obviously a very likeable guy and not without talent for tennis and other things I can see him being a great success in the world of tennis more broadly, the highlight of his playing career for me has to be his challenger refuelling.

If hed been a footballer he would have had a great career and plenty of fun somewhere between step 3 and 5 of non league where and this is not meant in a nasty way at all there are plenty of guys like Marcus who have a great time playing football despite carrying a few pounds at a good to very good level for a few quid. A decision would have been made very early on for him in his football career, pro clubs would have had a look at him, perhaps he would have even been in an academy for sometime and then something would have happened, ie turned up at the Australian Junior open without his rackets etc... and interest waned. For those that mature and get stuck in there is a way back in but even the most talented players have to grind relentlessly to get there.

I think if you are losing the Kyles of British Tennis as juniors that is when you really worry that the system is really broken. Obviously everything wasnt perfect for Kyle either but fundamentally the guy really wanted it. Similarly Jo Salisbury really wanted a doubles career proactively explored every avenue. A holistic approach is all well and good but coping with the rough edges of any process (resilience) is a fundamental for success.

Flexibility is also really important and Cams journey highlights another way that can be facilitated with the right type of player, big difference between the two in that Cam and his family were able to pull something together that kept him happy and motivated to which Cam was totally committed.