LTA bias to men starting on tour?

Coup Droit · Tennis legend

RE: LTA bias to men starting on tour?

korriban · Challenger level

I agree that this bonus scheme seems like a very good motivator and easy to tweak.

But I also believe that, subject to certain performance criteria being reached (ranking points would be the obvious one - a minimum ranking qualifies you for this support, but it should drop away once you start to "succeed" eg top 200 or 150), all players should receive upto a certain maximum level of support for travel, hotels and hotel expenses which would, say, cover half their costs for up to 10 overseas tournaments p.a. Once again, this can be tweaked to encourage Challengers in addition to Futures tournaments.

I really like the notion of having to give back 20% of gross prize money for the very few who will receive the top package of LTA support, and I also agree with doubles players not receiving support at the top tier either. With regret, top tier funding needs to be VERY targetted and prioritised........but if that means that the LTA can cast it's net a little wider further down the food chain, I think it's a great idea.

paulisi · Tennis legend

Maybe the LTA should invest in property in Sharm El Sheik or Anatalya. Rent it out to the GB tournament players under cutting the hotels and reducing their overheads. It would be an asset on the LTA's books and would probably pay for itself long term.

Coup Droit · Tennis legend

OK, this isn't bias against women starting on tour. But the LTA's bias against women coaches and Judy Murray is highlighted very movingly in this little clip. It's not conscious bias, it's not 'evil', it's just a sign of the under-currrent and the basic norms at the place. Obviously, it's from 2012 so that's not yesterday - but it's not that long ago either....

twitter.com/i/status/1351535648558223360

junior · Intermediate Club Player

This is a silly thread, I can settle all debates, no one outside top 20 in the world can make their living from tennis directly

-- Edited by junior on Thursday 21st of January 2021 11:58:55 AM

junior · Intermediate Club Player

paulisi wrote:
Maybe the LTA should invest in property in Sharm El Sheik or Anatalya. Rent it out to the GB tournament players under cutting the hotels and reducing their overheads. It would be an asset on the LTA's books and would probably pay for itself long term.

They already did, La Manga in Spain, it's mostly used by senio social holidayers

junior · Intermediate Club Player

Coup Droit wrote:
OK, this isn't bias against women starting on tour. But the LTA's bias against women coaches and Judy Murray is highlighted very movingly in this little clip. It's not conscious bias, it's not 'evil', it's just a sign of the under-currrent and the basic norms at the place. Obviously, it's from 2012 so that's not yesterday - but it's not that long ago either....

twitter.com/i/status/1351535648558223360

Biggest problem of the LTA is making Judy Murray the be all and end all of tennis in Britain, she's done very well for herself off it, considering she is but a parent who sent their kid away to an academy for them to create him and for her to take credit.

Spireman · Club Coach

Might be good if she had more influence and power in British tennis.....After all she does know what it takes from a tennis parent when players start out and what it takes in commitment, sacrifices etc from players to succeed (and from a part of gb where it was/is harder to start out in tennis, away from south easts tennis resources.
She has done a huge amount with She Rallies around the country to meet lots of girls playing tennis as well as female coaches. Many of the girls she has met will have been inspired in some way...of course very very few will in any way make it as pro players but they probably will contribute to the tennis pyramid that is so important. They will be opponents for others on their way up, they will be officials, coaches supporters, future tennis parents etc. So I think we need to use her experience as much as we can.

junior · Intermediate Club Player

This has gone off topic, unfortunately my experience leads me to disagree with everything you have written.

JonH comes home · Tennis legend

junior wrote:
This has gone off topic, unfortunately my experience leads me to disagree with everything you have written.

Hi junior . No angle but interested. Are you an ex player, current player, ex administrator, lta employee, David Lloyd, Andrew castle etc. Jesting but interested in your background and why you hold your view. Im just a casual observer and tennis fan, judy generally feels like a good thing , but I know nothing at all of it beyond media profile.

indiana · Tennis legend

Yes, I too would be interested to hear specifics as to why there could be so much to disagree about Spireman and Jon's thoughts about Judy.

eg. implications that she has got to where she is just by being Andy and Jamie's mother are not that. What are her shortcomings that have become apparent in say her coaching or management skills that mean she should not play some more significant part in UK tennis moving forwards? She's certainly hardly the "be all and end all" at present, and nor do I see it said that she should be, even if some may think we could do worse.

-- Edited by indiana on Sunday 24th of January 2021 02:24:23 PM

Deucebag · Intermediate Club Player

Hmmmm I stumbled upon this thread as not much else going on in the tennis world at the moment. It would be great for someone like Judy murray to get involved in British tennis as a possible parent mentor or with our 10-15 year olds as she is a parent who has been there, seen it and done it but would she really want to do it?
Is it not common knowledge in the tennis world that the Murrays were paid a handsome figure (when he was about to break through)to keep quiet about the LTA!s neglect of both of her sons? I think she was also offered some sort of role back then but Im not sure if she got involved or not. I have only been on this message board for a few months but please tell me that this is not new news.

JonH comes home · Tennis legend

Deucebag wrote:
Hmmmm I stumbled upon this thread as not much else going on in the tennis world at the moment. It would be great for someone like Judy murray to get involved in British tennis as a possible parent mentor or with our 10-15 year olds as she is a parent who has been there, seen it and done it but would she really want to do it?
Is it not common knowledge in the tennis world that the Murrays were paid a handsome figure (when he was about to break through)to keep quiet about the LTA!s neglect of both of her sons? I think she was also offered some sort of role back then but Im not sure if she got involved or not. I have only been on this message board for a few months but please tell me that this is not new news.

Never, ever heard that information deucebag. Complete news !

junior · Intermediate Club Player

I hope today is the day the LTA or someone important comes across this thread haha

As far as the original point goes, funding has now become irrelevent, only Britain make it a big deal to continue this ilusion that you can play tennis without money so as people dont then drop out when they realise (I'm sure we've all seen that even the wealthiest of folk dont want to spend a penny of their own money if they can avoid it and act like they were poor). The LTA are stupid with their funding money, is there really any bias in stupidity? Now its only used as a topic point to deflect and avert blame when one is not performing well (i.e Ms Broady, Ms Watson).

As far as Judy goes, would hardly call it been there, seen it, done it. The only advice she might be able to give is "to get the LTA to spend lots of money to fund your child to go to Spain to train so you as a parent can make yourself famous and powerful off it". If thousands of pounds funding and years of help is "neglect" then what would the rest of us who never received even a howdy call it? I would class her as one of the nightmare parents trying to piggyback their way to fame (along with all the others: Leon Smith, Colin Fleming etc) I've seen Judy on everything from Fed Cup Captain (even though I'm not sure her qualifications to have been so, at best she 'trained' Andy until he was about 10, and if this is true so then I'm not sure exactly how/where Leon Smith enters into the picture?) even up to appearing on shows such as QI, Strictly come dancing up to your average cooking show. To me Judy is just another tennis parent who has managed to take advantage of other peoples success (her son, Spanish training and any input the LTA had in Andy) and coerce her way into a high position at the LTA.

-- Edited by junior on Sunday 24th of January 2021 08:45:42 AM

JonH comes home · Tennis legend

junior wrote:
I hope today is the day the LTA or someone important comes across this thread haha

As far as the original point goes, funding has now become irrelevent, only Britain make it a big deal to continue this ilusion that you can play tennis without money so as people dont then drop out when they realise (I'm sure we've all seen that even the wealthiest of folk dont want to spend a penny of their own money if they can avoid it and act like they were poor). The LTA are stupid with their funding money, is there really any bias in stupidity? Now its only used as a topic point to deflect and avert blame when one is not performing well (i.e Ms Broady, Ms Watson).

As far as Judy goes, would hardly call it been there, seen it, done it. The only advice she might be able to give is "to get the LTA to spend lots of money to fund your child to go to Spain to train so you as a parent can make yourself famous and powerful off it". If thousands of pounds funding and years of help is "neglect" then what would the rest of us who never received even a howdy call it? I would class her as one of the nightmare parents trying to piggyback their way to fame (along with all the others: Leon Smith, Colin Fleming etc) I've seen Judy on everything from Fed Cup Captain (even though I'm not sure her qualifications to have been so, at best she 'trained' Andy until he was about 10, and if this is true so then I'm not sure exactly how/where Leon Smith enters into the picture?) even up to appearing on shows such as QI, Strictly come dancing up to your average cooking show. To me Judy is just another tennis parent who has managed to take advantage of other peoples success (her son, Spanish training and any input the LTA had in Andy) and coerce her way into a high position at the LTA.

-- Edited by junior on Sunday 24th of January 2021 08:45:42 AM

There clearly is a long period of mismanagement and of people not qualified to run things doing so, and paying themselves lots of money on the way.
and that you need money is clear. Tennis in gb is and will be that way , I find it hard to see how the likes of Paul jubb will make it without backers and I find it hard to see how the likes of a player ranked below the top 100 keeps sustaining a career without big backing from mummy and daddy or from corporate sponsors or sugar daddies. how can a player earn maybe 50k in a year, spend 30k on travel, pay a coach etc and live a life independently, without backing ?