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Post Info TOPIC: Week 39 - WTA Premier 5 - Tokyo, Japan - Hard
tony_orient


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RE: Week 39 - WTA Premier 5 - Tokyo, Japan - Hard
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korriban wrote:
TomTraubert wrote:

robbo gets home fave morita (61) in r1

2-1 to robbo in the series she won in carlsabdthis year, but ayumi won in oeiras


Several players younger than her can pass her here if they out perform her by a round or 2

That's good because then we may finally hear the end of this "yes. but she's still the highest ranked teenager in the top 100" line which many use as a counter-argument against any form of constructive criticism.

There are 2 WTA players IMHO who get a disproportionate amount of coverage compared to their actual achievements, because they can beat almost any of the top players on their day, because they are ranked highly at a young age (although that's changing), because they have been deemed "Future Grand Slam winners" by many pundits, because they tend to do better at GSs, and because they are fun and photogenic. Laura and Sloane.

Laura has won a single pro tournament, the Sunderland $10k as a 14 year old almost 5 years ago. That's it. She's played in over 120 singles and doubles tournaments since then of various standards. Sloane has also won just a single pro tournament (plus just 1 doubles), a $50k over 2 years ago. That's it. I think both are terrific players, wonderful to watch on their day, and possible future stars, but both seem to have had the unfortunate habit throughout their careers of throwing in bad matches in almost every tournament - perhaps losing with style, rather than winning ugly. If you look at the rest of the top 100's actual tournament records, even the younger guns, they pretty much ALL have better track records of actually winning tournaments of various pay grades.

I find this record bizarre. If we are still here in 12 months time, and despite no doubt a raft of brilliant wins against top 10 players and perhaps new career highs, neither Sloane nor Laura has still won a tournament of any kind will anyone agree with me that there may be something in their mental make-up that is not the stuff of champions?

PLEASE NOTE - I'm a huge fan of both Laura Robson and Sloane Stephens as a tennis watcher biggrin - but the desire/ability to WIN rather than play great tennis is what separates the great from the good - as Richard Gasquet and other geniuses prove.

 



-- Edited by korriban on Friday 20th of September 2013 08:41:00 AM

 One factor with Laura (and with Sloane too) is that as she has got her ranking up through winning rounds of the bigger tournaments, she doesn't actually play many tournaments where she has a realistic chance of winning. Guangzhou was the first one in quite a long time where Laura would have been aiming to win rather than just a couple of rounds. When she has entered smaller tournaments, they have typically been the first one of a tour, often as a way to get used to a different surface.

You can argue both ways as to whether winning titles or beating top players is a better indication of major future success and there aren't any young players who are doing both.



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Coup Droit


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It's true that in three months or so Laura will turn 20 and not be a 'teenager' any more. And, yes, thank heavens we'll get rid of that 'title'.

And that Eugenie and Madison (both younger) are close to overtaking her.

And, of course, very close (and also younger) is that world-famous player, practically the highest ranking teenager in women's tennis - Elina Svitolina ! Yes, the papers are full of her. (Presumably, the Ukrainian papers are indeed full of her, of course . . . .).

For me, I still think that Laura is well on track and doing very well, and will be top 10. But I can understand the other side of it.


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tony_orient


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Coup Droit wrote:

It's true that in three months or so Laura will turn 20 and not be a 'teenager' any more. And, yes, thank heavens we'll get rid of that 'title'.

And that Eugenie and Madison (both younger) are close to overtaking her.

And, of course, very close (and also younger) is that world-famous player, practically the highest ranking teenager in women's tennis - Elina Svitolina ! Yes, the papers are full of her. (Presumably, the Ukrainian papers are indeed full of her, of course . . . .).

For me, I still think that Laura is well on track and doing very well, and will be top 10. But I can understand the other side of it.

 Elina Svitolina has indeed crept up the rankings almost completely unnoticed. As I result I made a point of watching her play Christina McHale in the US Open. The fact that McHale was very much the aggressor in that match tells you all you need to know about Svitolina's style of play. If she can develop some power and aggression to her athleticism and consistency (as Heather has been doing) we might start hearing more about her.



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tony_orient


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steven wrote:

QR1: (q5) Heather Watson WR 78 beat Yurika Sema (JPN) WR 229 (CH 142 in 2009) by 1 & 0

FQR: (q5) Heather Watson WR 78 v (q11) Barbora Záhlavová-Strýcová (CZE) WR 110 (CH 39* in 2010)

* the same career high as Hev herself

 Appropriate that two players with a career high of 39 should meet just after Jill Craybas (who also has a CH high of 39) announces her retirement. And in a week 39 tournament.



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Coup Droit


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tony_orient wrote:
steven wrote:

QR1: (q5) Heather Watson WR 78 beat Yurika Sema (JPN) WR 229 (CH 142 in 2009) by 1 & 0

FQR: (q5) Heather Watson WR 78 v (q11) Barbora Záhlavová-Strýcová (CZE) WR 110 (CH 39* in 2010)

* the same career high as Hev herself

 Appropriate that two players with a career high of 39 should meet just after Jill Craybas (who also has a CH high of 39) announces her retirement. And in a week 39 tournament.

 

And, of course, Jill Craybas is aged 39 !

(just to state the obvious . . . )

Well spotted smile



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indiana


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Bah, Laura is still the highest ranked teenager in the world !

Anyway, personally while I have mentioned this as an indication that things aren't going too horribly, I recently went to quite some lengths on other points in respinse to korriban posts, so it wasn't masking any attempt at arguement or whatever. I am never afraid to take on discussion / arguement at length LOL

Actually, I reckon most of us agree much about Laura, eg. great talent, frustratingly inconsistent, would have wished for a better year - but different degrees of making allowance for some of this, different emphases on certain issues and some different thoughts as to where she will ultimately get to. Oh, and whether "hype" is any real issue / problem.

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indiana


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Well done to Heather.

I reckon her game has got back to a pretty good place from the US Open on. Was interesting to see how she dealt with a lower ranked opponent as opposed to putting up encouraging performances against well ranked / in form players. Dealt with it pretty well, I'd say !

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steven


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Coup Droit wrote:
tony_orient wrote:
steven wrote:

QR1: (q5) Heather Watson WR 78 beat Yurika Sema (JPN) WR 229 (CH 142 in 2009) by 1 & 0

FQR: (q5) Heather Watson WR 78 v (q11) Barbora Záhlavová-Strýcová (CZE) WR 110 (CH 39* in 2010)

* the same career high as Hev herself

 Appropriate that two players with a career high of 39 should meet just after Jill Craybas (who also has a CH high of 39) announces her retirement. And in a week 39 tournament.

 

And, of course, Jill Craybas is aged 39 !

(just to state the obvious . . . )

Well spotted smile

I'm shocked at myself for not spotting all those other '39' links disbelief (or maybe not wink)



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Jeff Stelling


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Would say I'm in agreement with korriban on Robson. Not a player I make much effort to follow due to her baffling faults and inconsistencies. She has plenty of time to turn it around though and has undeniable talent, so here's hoping.

On a sad note, I wasn't impressed to see someone on my Twitter feed try to re-start that tennis grenades hashtag about Laura and Heather. If anyone on here is doing it then please desist. Laura and Heather can't help the way they look and it is most unedifying to see such preoccupation concerning two well-mannered young women's appearances. Criticise their tennis by all means, anything personal way oversteps the mark IMO.

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indiana


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Ha Ha, I can never work out how much Adrian Durham believes himself remotely half of the stuff he comes out with. Really just seeking a reaction or he would no doubt claim stimulating a debate. He's frankly a very poor man's Richard Littlejohn ( really, for these who don't know him ).

He just tends to go totally OTT, comes across as ignorant and extremely annoying ( and that's without hearing him pontificate about Laura, which is probably for the best ! )

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steven


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Jeff Stelling wrote:


On a sad note, I wasn't impressed to see someone on my Twitter feed try to re-start that tennis grenades hashtag about Laura and Heather. If anyone on here is doing it then please desist. Laura and Heather can't help the way they look and it is most unedifying to see such preoccupation concerning two well-mannered young women's appearances. Criticise their tennis by all means, anything personal way oversteps the mark IMO.

*baffled* - what on earth are you talking about? (on second thoughts, maybe I'd rather not know)



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Spectator


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I too am baffled. And definitely don't want to know. I cannot fathom why anyone should wish to make derogatory comments about either Ms Robson or Ms Watson ... especially such that it was felt necessary to defend either of them in re: their appearance. And would assume that no person who actually cared about tennis (and thus by implication no one on this board) would do such a thing.









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philwrig


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tony_orient wrote:
Coup Droit wrote:

It's true that in three months or so Laura will turn 20 and not be a 'teenager' any more. And, yes, thank heavens we'll get rid of that 'title'.

And that Eugenie and Madison (both younger) are close to overtaking her.

And, of course, very close (and also younger) is that world-famous player, practically the highest ranking teenager in women's tennis - Elina Svitolina ! Yes, the papers are full of her. (Presumably, the Ukrainian papers are indeed full of her, of course . . . .).

For me, I still think that Laura is well on track and doing very well, and will be top 10. But I can understand the other side of it.

 Elina Svitolina has indeed crept up the rankings almost completely unnoticed. As I result I made a point of watching her play Christina McHale in the US Open. The fact that McHale was very much the aggressor in that match tells you all you need to know about Svitolina's style of play. If she can develop some power and aggression to her athleticism and consistency (as Heather has been doing) we might start hearing more about her.

 I'm baffled by Svitolina's popularity particularly on TF, where they tend to hate players who hit very little winners and don't make UEs. I watched her match against Vekic recently, which proved that she is a high quality counter puncher but without any major weapons. She was just basically waiting for Vekic to implode, which of course she eventually did. She has picked up most of her ranking points in weaker events as per Beck last year. Beck has struggled this year, I suspect Elina will struggle somewhat next year.



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philwrig


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Very impressive scoreline for Hev, and based upon what KDK has done in Seoul, maybe Hev is after all looking in a better spot, BMS will be a good barometer.

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john


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Laura accelerated up the rankings very quickly, and has been very ambitious in her tournament selection along the way, meaning she has always really been playing tournaments where a couple of wins represented a good week, and never really had a shot at winning them. Titles will come, be patient.

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