Week 32 - Great Britain F16 ($15,000) - Chiswick (Hard)

RJA · Hall of fame

Week 32 - Great Britain F16 ($15,000) - Chiswick (Hard)

Bob in Spain · Tennis legend

indiana wrote:
I am on my mobile which is both harder to type on and I can't correct after I send. AND my eyesight isn't the best !

The message is more important than the typos LOL

Yeah. But the message is so much more fun with all the typos in it biggrin

Salmon · Tennis legend

Cox sure had quite a bit left in his tank after last week's title! Hopefully there's enough for another win and then he can rest the limbs for a few days.

philwrig · Hall of fame

Coxy continuing to roll out those wins, just one more will make me very happy, might make Boy think before deciding to return to these shores. Can't have these foreigners pinching our points and our prize money.

RJA · Hall of fame

philwrig wrote:
Coxy continuing to roll out those wins, just one more will make me very happy, might make Boy think before deciding to return to these shores. Can't have these foreigners pinching our points and our prize money.

On a serious note I prefer to see a few decent foreigners playing futures in this country. British players winning futures is all well and good but if they are only doing it because the fields are weak it doesn't do much for their long term development.

scottie1 · Futures level

RJA wrote:
philwrig wrote:
Coxy continuing to roll out those wins, just one more will make me very happy, might make Boy think before deciding to return to these shores. Can't have these foreigners pinching our points and our prize money.
On a serious note I prefer to see a few decent foreigners playing futures in this country. British players winning futures is all well and good but if they are only doing it because the fields are weak it doesn't do much for their long term development.

i am not getting carried away with this! Sorry ! We had Goodall last year winning everything in sight at Futures levels in GB ==Big Fish Little Pond for me+= but he could not step up to next level. Corrie won everything in site earlier this year but he is another who has not stepped up at challenger level. Dan Cox on a role yes but can he step up to next level I am unsure_- If He beats the Dutchman then that is a good result. but there is a large ranking gap between Evans And klein nos 3 and 4 and frankly I cannot see this gap being bridged soon unless our best prospect Kyle Edmund does it!

Shhh · Challenger level

Dan has two weeks off after this to recharge, then Wrexham 10k or, the Bangkok challenger where he may creep in...........but would most likely be seeded qualies. If he travelled out to the latter, it would certainly show a good level of intent.

philwrig · Hall of fame

RJA wrote:
philwrig wrote:
Coxy continuing to roll out those wins, just one more will make me very happy, might make Boy think before deciding to return to these shores. Can't have these foreigners pinching our points and our prize money.
On a serious note I prefer to see a few decent foreigners playing futures in this country. British players winning futures is all well and good but if they are only doing it because the fields are weak it doesn't do much for their long term development.

Ahh but I think we have alot of strength in depth now in this country, and these tournaments are getting stronger without overseas players coming over and playing them. We shall see but I expect Dan to win tomorrow, also neither of the top seeds had easy routes to the final, again proving the strength of our 'middle order' to coin a cricketing term.

Coup Droit · Tennis legend

I know what you mean scottie1, but I don;t think that it's quite fair about players like Ed.

Yes, they had an amazing run in futures and, yes, they;ve found Challengers more difficult. But that's as it should be - challengers ARE more difficult. One can't expect to move up and suddenly nail it and win in the same way that was one in futures.
In fact, this year Ed has 15 points from one Challenger, 3 from another and two 0 pointers. That doesn't seem unreasonable as a first attempt.

I think Dan Cox is a player in a similar vein - i.e. solid, athletic, hard-working and will do well. But will not fly through. I think that they can close the gap and get close to top 200. But I'm hoping that by the time they do, Dan Evans will be sailing closer to the top 100 and the actual gap will remain the same.

indiana · Tennis legend

Some players have certainly improved. But it is also undoubtably the case that the GB Futues have had a large effect on.the increase in numbers hitting various ranking levels.

Interesting to see some stats. Thanks, RJA.

philwrig · Hall of fame

RJA wrote:
philwrig wrote:
RJA wrote:
philwrig wrote:
Coxy continuing to roll out those wins, just one more will make me very happy, might make Boy think before deciding to return to these shores. Can't have these foreigners pinching our points and our prize money.
On a serious note I prefer to see a few decent foreigners playing futures in this country. British players winning futures is all well and good but if they are only doing it because the fields are weak it doesn't do much for their long term development.
Ahh but I think we have alot of strength in depth now in this country, and these tournaments are getting stronger without overseas players coming over and playing them. We shall see but I expect Dan to win tomorrow, also neither of the top seeds had easy routes to the final, again proving the strength of our 'middle order' to coin a cricketing term.
But do we have greater strength in depth or is it just an illusion based on weak fields. If we look at this year the major change to the futures calender has involved the indoor hard court tournaments. If we look at the early season hard court futures and compare 2012 to 2013 this is what we find.
In 2012 the were five 15K futures. The fields were most dominated by foreign players with all of them having 4-6 foreign players as seeds and on 3 occasions the top 5 seeds were all foreign. Just one Brit won a tournament (Evans won Sheffield) and British players picked up 141 points, out of total of 430 on offer.
In 2013 there were eight 10K futures. The fields were much weaker with the number of foreign seeds ranging from 2 to 5, and there only being 2-3 for six of the events. British players won six titles (Corrie x 3, Willis, Evans and Smethurst) and picked up 329 points, out of 448 on offer.
Obviously these statistics don't prove anything and some of our improved players have largely played abroad. However I don't think we can read too much into the number of Brits ranked in the top 500 or the ranking position of the the 20th or 25th ranked Brit.

-- Edited by RJA on Friday 9th of August 2013 09:04:33 PM

It's probably a combination of the 2, but I have no doubt that the standard of our middle order has improved markedly.

steven · Tennis legend

I agree with Phil that it's a combination of the two effects. I've been sounding a note of caution all year about the dangers of getting too complacent re. all the points being picked up from GB Futures this year, when a sudden influx of even just one or two good non-Brits could see that source of points dry up significantly - another reason why it's so important that those getting a boost from these Futures have a go at Challengers while their rankings are high enough to get them into the odd Challenger and seeded in qualies for others.

The positive signs though are that:

- when good non-Brits (Harrison, Coric, etc) have come along, they haven't had it all their own way by any means (#)
- there must be a reason why less non-Brits are playing in 10Ks in the UK even though there have been less (non-clay) events available in general this year (*)
- i.e. it suggests potential non-GB entrants see GB Futures are less reliable sources of points than they used to be because the Brits are getting stronger
- Brits are making waves in non-GB Futures as well more often than they used to

So yes, we mustn't get carried away, but I do think we have a lot more depth at Futures level than we used to - it is converting that into more decent Challenger-level players that is, as ever, the big challenge.

(#) of course, previous Brit-bashers may have been stronger players, it's hard to tell
(*) I realise non-Brits are more likely to be attracted to 15Ks than 10Ks and there used to be more of the former, but this year the draws at both levels are being dominated by Brits like never before

Coup Droit · Tennis legend

Dan breaks ! 5*-4

Blast - and gets broken back 5-5

-- Edited by Coup Droit on Saturday 10th of August 2013 10:52:11 AM

Coup Droit · Tennis legend

This has been one tight set, and one tight TB. All on serve 4-4 TB

5*-6 - serve is king - 6-6 - time to change ends . . .

-- Edited by Coup Droit on Saturday 10th of August 2013 11:13:00 AM

Coup Droit · Tennis legend

Shouldn't one also make some analysis of other countries' futures events for this argument to be swayed one way or the other ?

i.e.. are 'most' home events swamped by home players ? Does that mean that ALL the rankings are 'artificially' high ? Are the UK players just now in line with the others ?

(I don;t know if this is true but I remember a recent-ish post from steven about a futures in Brazil and one in Russia (and another?) that was 100% home players)