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Post Info TOPIC: LTA Funding and Participation


Tennis legend

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RE: LTA Funding and Participation


I didn't realise Dave Sammel was no longer employed by the LTA- according to an article in sporting life.

I assume Liam and others are paying him privately.

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Tennis legend

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here's the article:

www.sportinglife.com/tennis/news/article/553/9602812/tennis-leading-british-coach-claims-changes-to-lta-funding-will-result-in-people-leaving-the-sport

Sammel makes some very pertinent points.

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Hmm, I have real concerns about the profile of particularly the GB men top players in a few years, particularly once the 89/ 90 born group move on, before some would wish to or not.

Oh yes, that 89/90 generation, hyped and then considered a failure as a crop ( infamously by Roger Draper ) when they rather plateaued before many really pushing on again as 23 and 24 yos, as of course is not that unusual. They currently represent a high proportion of the best GB players. As Dave Sammel indicates - another group considered not good enough, next ! I wonder how many more years most will give it. And in spite of all evidence that 'policy" seems to be being intensified.

That possible top GB men profile I worry about :

Kyle Edmund, Liam Broady - progressing up the top 100, great, that's what we're about, then err...Cameron Norrie,, naa, bit old, his time has passed, then err... err...

Never mind, I am sure there will then be some great looking 14 and 15 year olds on the scene, let's throw all pur resources behind them.

PS : unfortunately, however it sounds that is not just meant as a piss take, but reflecting my uninformed concerns, but various ones seemingly similar to more informed folk much closer to the action.

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Sim


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I can understand why the LTA want to change funding and incentives, after all it is not as if the current/past policies have produced a conveyor belt of top players. I can also understand the logic of trying to get more young players into the sport and making sure they have good coaching. After all if you increase the number of players then this should lead to more top 100 players....eventually. The LTA also has to worry about central funding which is dependent on total number of players. I can also see the logic of not wanting to fund a whole load of players who plateau at 200-500 in world rankings.

However it will take 8-10 years for the current 12/13/14 years old to even get into the top 200 and no-one will wait that long for an improvement, so where is the medium term plan to cover that "gap". It has already been pointed out it takes longer for the top players, especially men, to get to their peak so how will the promising players manage to keep going if they are in the 200-500 range playing futures but moving upwards with good prospects of getting into top 200 if they can afford to keep playing....



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Comments like this from Oliver Golding don't really add to the players' cause:


oliver golding @oli_golding · 11h 11 hours ago

Tennis is a brutal sport. Players need all the help and support they can get. Money is an advantage we have over other countries, use it!


Brett and Downey must be smiling . . .

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Sammel is right. We shouldn't be looking down our noses at the hard working pros doing everything they can and maxing out their potential in the 150-400 range. These players are good targets and role models for new girls to compete against, train with and hopefully move past. Those players shouldn't have big funding but should be able to utilise the bonus pool and they are also those who can generally still compete well when the big events come to town each summer. We wants lots of players, but we have to accept not all will be world beaters, we need groups of players spread across the rankings so each step up the ladder looks attainable. At this rate we will loose the Whybourns, Murrays, Windleys too quickly if everything is being pulled from them.

And of course once you in the top 100 the need for funding starts to lessen a little, and things get easier the higher you go.

Oli's tweet is a bit stupid really.

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Lower Club Player

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The farce here is that while cutting back funding in some vital area's the LTA continue to fund players who don't actually need the money! Andy Murray earns millions every year and the LTA continue to contribute towards the payment of his entourage, Laura Robson has earned a huge amount of money through her career (although mainly through sponsorships) and is still heavily funded as is Heather Watson ! It could be argued that all three of these are self sufficient but for some reason the LTA like to give them more even money ? 



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All-time great

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Mr Sammel seems eminently sensible.

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County player

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It really is a thankless task, being a leader of the LTA.

Your job is to grow British "market share", being the percentage of top 100 players. You have a lot less money than your competitors (France, Germany, Spain, etc), but everybody thinks that you have pots of it ("they get all the profits from Wimbledon, you know ...). You have a much smaller pool of talent than them too, because in the UK tennis is for posh folk, and in career terms cricket is a better choice.

To make things even more complicated, you're now looking at a nearly 20-year lead-in time, from "planting" the talented young 8-10 year old, to "harvesting" a 27-year old entering the top 100. This makes it impossible to measure the success of differing methods of selection, training and motivation.

And how on earth do you allocate your limited funds - do you spend that spare £2 million building a new indoor tennis centre in Tower Hamlets, with the idea of growing the talent pool and a possible long-term pay-off? Or do you spend it hiring 20 top coaches with the short-term benefit of extracting maximum performance from the players you've already got?

And to top it all off, lots of noisy people have opinions - which is usually that you're a complete waste of space.

Anyway, good luck to Downey and Brett. I've no idea whether their plans will work - probably not, because when David takes on Goliath, Goliath usually wins.

(Oh, and yes I know that everyone's entitled to express their opinion ... healthy debate ... democracy ... yadda yadda ...)



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"Where Ratty leads - the rest soon follow" (Professor Henry Brubaker - The Institute of Studies)



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Ratty, the LTA Group Profit and Loss Statement for financial year-end (30th Sept.) 2013 says that the LTA had revenues of nearly £69 million. (£68,878,000 to be precise).

Although there is subsequently a lot of internal accounting with the LTA Trust (set up in 2012), this revenue figure is practically identical to 2012, and seems a very substantial figure of money to me and not a lot less than other competitors at all.



-- Edited by Coup Droit on Saturday 13th of December 2014 09:11:53 AM

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Interesting to hear alternative views. Some very reasonable points even if it is clearly debatable how limited the limited resources are compared to other countries.

Pity about the old boring stuff towards the end, the opinion on opinions, but hey...

And if Ratty properly read most of the posts, he would see quite a lot of stuff about probably some decent ideas there. There has been a consistent main issue of real concern though, with articulate reasons why it is a concern, the seeming you're totally in the LTA system or you're on your own pal stuff. I would be interested to see any case as to this seeming absolute stark choice approach being a good idea as distinct to retaining more flexibility.

Of course, we need many more coaches at all levels, that has been brought up many times in the past on this forum so unsurprisingly has been welcomed. Again here, the big issue of concern has been such a coupling of the current player arrangements ( and possible future arrangements ) with the coach development, what I have called the guinea pigging. To me, you can certainly develop coaches while leaving some ( but maybe less ) flexibility for players with maybe less ( but still some ) LTA support for other approaches.

Anyway, moving on from these untackled points, of course the LTA have a very difficult task with limited resources. To build that inner city tennis centre or focus yet further on more coaches, to invest in 10 yos against 24 yos, these are tough choices. But few suggest otherwise and the ongoing debates re best use of resources I find interesting and often quite illuminating.

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Tennis legend

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Another player to do herself no favours is Tara Moore.She has moaned about the bonus fund cuts despite earning $68k in prize money this year.

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paulisi wrote:

Another player to do herself no favours is Tara Moore.She has moaned about the bonus fund cuts despite earning $68k in prize money this year.


 

Yes cry Absolutely. She was one of my 'very talented, well-funded and (so far) hugely under-preforming' players' (see above) who have a tendency to constantly gripe about the lack of support they get . . .



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Pro player

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A thankless task remunerated quite handsomely.

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County player

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Track Cycling is a sport where the UK has successfully won market share in recent years. The differences with tennis are illustrative, in my view:

  • Globally it's not nearly as popular as tennis, and so a large injection of resources gave the UK a significant competitive advantage.
  • The bike is more important than the rider, and the pay-off from employing expensive engineers to design better bikes was immediate.
  • The lead-in time for training a cyclist is far shorter. For example, Rebecca Romero went from non-cyclist to Olympic Champion in 2 years. 

Sure we'll get the odd random UK success story in tennis, but until it supplants cricket as the favoured sport for the middle class, I'm just not seeing how we can ever make a sustained improvement. The competition is just too fierce.



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