Week 24 - ATP 250 - London Queen's Club, UK (grass)

Jan · Hall of fame

RE: Week 24 - ATP 250 - London Queen's Club, UK (grass)

steven · Tennis legend

Sorry I missed Dan's first top 50 scalp, though I guess it wasn't streamed anyway - what an excellent win

No longer 'just' a beneficiary of a very nice draw in R1 - though the scoreline made that win impressive too.

So is Dan going to stun Delpo and go on to meet Muzz in the Final or will Delpo win and be 'sure' of the title? (based on all of Evo's previous tournaments this year)

For what it's worth, I agree with RJA that this win won't lift Dan into the top 250.

The Magician Santoro · Top national player

Don't think this has been done...

R32: (WC) Dan Evans WR 277 def. (13) Jarkko Nieminen (FIN) WR 37 6-4, 6-7, 6-4

R16: (WC) Dan Evans WR 277 v. (3) Juan Martin Del Potro (ARG) WR 8

Career high win for Evans, no?

RJA · Hall of fame

Yes, definitely a career high win and of active British players I think that only Murray and Ward have beaten a higher ranked player.

RJA · Hall of fame

Ok another moan I have today. Are the the people responsible for today's scheduling a Queen's total morons?

The weather forecast was always pretty dicey, the odd shower through the day and and then from around 4PM - 5PM very little prospect of play. They understandably brought the start time forward but this gain in playing time was wasted because they only used 4 courts (at one point yesterday they were using 6 courts). They also played a doubles match first up on one court. Hence we are at the end of day 3 and only 12 second round matches have been completed, one hasn't even started. Had they scheduled today more sensibly they could have completed the second round singles by around 4PM and then kept some doubles matches on schedule just in case the whether was better than expected. Instead Murray will have to finish his match against Mahut and play another match tomorrow while Tsonga faces two full matches in one day.

RJA · Hall of fame

stevemcqueen wrote:
All this is a question of balance. A young man should be allowed to have a few beers and occasionally a few too many. What wouldn't be acceptable is turning up to training and not being able to give it 100% because of too much fun the night before. Dan is never going to be an ascetic, I don't think anybody wants that.

This is very, very true. Anyone who thinks that Dan will ever be model pro are deluding themselves. There is no point in trying to force him to be something that goes against his personality. Like the rest of us professional sportsmen need to find the right work/life balance. For someone like Dan too much work and not enough life would be totally counter productive, he would be as miserable as sin and that isn't a good formula for playing well.

It's the same for him on court. There are still people who sit there tutting every time he flings his racquet to the ground, berates himself or argues with an umpire. He needs to be like this, he is a fiery character on court and a bit anger often brings out his best tennis. Trying to suppress his natural instincts on court well never do him any good. Obviously that doesn't mean anything goes, there are lines which shouldn't be crossed.

-- Edited by RJA on Thursday 13th of June 2013 09:31:37 AM

RJA · Hall of fame

He is going for a bit too much and missing. It is also very windy and contrary to popular opinion about this match I don't think that really suits Dan, he often struggles with his serve when it is windy.

-- Edited by RJA on Thursday 13th of June 2013 01:31:14 PM

RJA · Hall of fame

Second set was pretty good. I am sure Dan will be disappointed with how he played the first set, he just didn't do himself justice.

All in all a great week for Dan and I don't think today's experience will do him any harm, quite the opposite, he should learn a lot from it.

-- Edited by RJA on Thursday 13th of June 2013 02:12:43 PM

stevemcqueen · Futures qualifying

I think Dan will be pleased to have the prospect of rain and damp courts. He'll move better than the big man. Its also quite windy here today - the worse the conditions, the better his chances I think.

Is Dan or any of our grass court specialists going to travel to Rhode Island after Wimbledon? Last acceptance into the qualies was 500 last year which is about as low as it gets for ATP tournaments. Last year James Ward and Bloomers went but both crashed out in QR1.

RJA · Hall of fame

stevemcqueen wrote:
Is Dan or any of our grass court specialists going to travel to Rhode Island after Wimbledon? Last acceptance into the qualies was 500 last year which is about as low as it gets for ATP tournaments. Last year James Ward and Bloomers went but both crashed out in QR1.

I always think that more of our guys should try Newport as it is great opportunity for a good grass court player to earn big points (as Bloomers did a few years back).

In the case of Dan, I think he was waiting to see how the grass court season went before deciding on his next move. Personally I would like to see him playing most of the American hard court challengers over the summer, maybe with some ATP quallies in between, in the lead up to US Open quallies. It would be great if he went out and played Newport prior to that but I guess the question is does Dan want to spend 2 straight months in America.

korriban · Challenger level

By rights Dan ought to be battered today by Delpo. However, I think most of us are confident that this won't happen, and he will acquit himself well. If he somehow wins the match, which is unlikely but not impossible, what does the LTA/AELTC do re his QWC. If he isn't upgraded on the spot, this will raise so many questions. If Dan is still up to his old tricks, despite assurances to the contrary, and a very generous and forgiving attitude from the LTA, it puts them in an impossible position. He's 23, not 16, so there comes a point when you run out of chances........

Let's be clear, without the generosity of the LTA to provide big ticket domestic WCs, GB physical training and practice facilities, technical backup, and overseas travel and coaching support, Dan's ranking and earning power goes nowhere. Talent alone is not enough. No more chances.

Coup Droit · Tennis legend

I agree with the overall gist.

Dan accepts all the LTA benefits so has to abide by the rules. His choice is to do as Marion Bartoli did to the FFT and tell the LTA to take a hike and go it alone (which, yes, is pretty unlikely to go anywhere).

And, yes, he's 23 not 16 (and not 20 as the Guardian claims). But this also works the other way round too.

Dan has to act a man and not a kid. But the LTA have to treat him as a man and not as a kid. Chicken and egg maybe. And maybe they've both tried and got nowhere and here's where we are now.

But I question again the LTA and its understanding and use of sports psychology. This has already come up as a major question mark in relation to James Ward and Anne K.

I would also like to add one point - last year, at a major junior international tournament, the French, Spanish, Serbian, US, German teams all had coaches and trainers who were in their thirties and forties - fit, athletic, really imposing top sportsman. AND quite fun and young. Lots of work and lots of laughter.

The UK team had trainers with an average age of about 55 (being generous!) - old-fashioned, skinny guys, who sliced every backhand back to the players when warming up even though the youngsters' opponents were never going to hit a sliced backhand in the whole match and so the British kids were practicing with completely the wrong trajectory. And old. Serious. Kindly but quiet and dull.

Maybe this is not the same in the adults but, if it is, then a body of old men/women is not the right body of people to be mentoring a group of youngsters. Some may well be very good. But you need a mix and a better representation.

RJA · Hall of fame

korriban wrote:
By rights Dan ought to be battered today by Delpo. However, I think most of us are confident that this won't happen, and he will acquit himself well. If he somehow wins the match, which is unlikely but not impossible, what does the LTA/AELTC do re his QWC. If he isn't upgraded on the spot, this will raise so many questions. If Dan is still up to his old tricks, despite assurances to the contrary, and a very generous and forgiving attitude from the LTA, it puts them in an impossible position. He's 23, not 16, so there comes a point when you run out of chances........
Let's be clear, without the generosity of the LTA to provide big ticket domestic WCs, GB physical training and practice facilities, technical backup, and overseas travel and coaching support, Dan's ranking and earning power goes nowhere. Talent alone is not enough. No more chances.

I think the problem here is that

a) We don't know what Dan has allegedly done, so it is really hard to comment

b) If he keeps winning matches against good opposition it makes it almost impossible for the LTA not to continue supporting him unless he done something really, really bad. It would be lunacy for them to drop him at a time when things are going so well.

korriban · Challenger level

RJA wrote:
korriban wrote:
By rights Dan ought to be battered today by Delpo. However, I think most of us are confident that this won't happen, and he will acquit himself well. If he somehow wins the match, which is unlikely but not impossible, what does the LTA/AELTC do re his QWC. If he isn't upgraded on the spot, this will raise so many questions. If Dan is still up to his old tricks, despite assurances to the contrary, and a very generous and forgiving attitude from the LTA, it puts them in an impossible position. He's 23, not 16, so there comes a point when you run out of chances........
Let's be clear, without the generosity of the LTA to provide big ticket domestic WCs, GB physical training and practice facilities, technical backup, and overseas travel and coaching support, Dan's ranking and earning power goes nowhere. Talent alone is not enough. No more chances.
I think the problem here is that
a) We don't know what Dan has allegedly done, so it is really hard to comment
b) If he keeps winning matches against good opposition it makes it almost impossible for the LTA not to continue supporting him unless he done something really, really bad. It would be lunacy for them to drop him at a time when things are going so well.

I don't want them to drop him! He's a (potentially) very good player, and the LTA have shown themselves up in a very good light for being "big" enough to give him another chance, and then supporting him with everyhting they have got. But that second chance comes with very clear conditions, doesn't it, and if he ultimately proves to be too immature to take advantage of it (or simply unable to lead a professional life), then he should be "struck off" and left to his own devices.....at 23, that's what the FFT would do anyway even with "model" students!

RJA · Hall of fame

korriban wrote:
RJA wrote:
korriban wrote:
By rights Dan ought to be battered today by Delpo. However, I think most of us are confident that this won't happen, and he will acquit himself well. If he somehow wins the match, which is unlikely but not impossible, what does the LTA/AELTC do re his QWC. If he isn't upgraded on the spot, this will raise so many questions. If Dan is still up to his old tricks, despite assurances to the contrary, and a very generous and forgiving attitude from the LTA, it puts them in an impossible position. He's 23, not 16, so there comes a point when you run out of chances........
Let's be clear, without the generosity of the LTA to provide big ticket domestic WCs, GB physical training and practice facilities, technical backup, and overseas travel and coaching support, Dan's ranking and earning power goes nowhere. Talent alone is not enough. No more chances.
I think the problem here is that
a) We don't know what Dan has allegedly done, so it is really hard to comment
b) If he keeps winning matches against good opposition it makes it almost impossible for the LTA not to continue supporting him unless he done something really, really bad. It would be lunacy for them to drop him at a time when things are going so well.
I don't want them to drop him! He's a (potentially) very good player, and the LTA have shown themselves up in a very good light for being "big" enough to give him another chance, and then supporting him with everyhting they have got. But that second chance comes with very clear conditions, doesn't it, and if he ultimately proves to be too immature to take advantage of it (or simply unable to lead a professional life), then he should be "struck off" and left to his own devices.....at 23, that's what the FFT would do anyway even with "model" students!

Well yes, but again there are practical realities. The FFT have plenty of talented players, we don't. To a degree Dan can get away with most things as long as he does the business on the court.