Andy appoints Lendl as Coach

Reeltime · Satellite level

Andy appoints Lendl as Coach

Reeltime · Satellite level

And confirmed by Facebook:

"Very happy to announce that Ivan Lendl is my new full time coach. His impact on the game is unquestionable and he brings experience and knowledge that few others have, particularly in major tournaments. Happy New Year :)"

kundalini · Specialist Reporter + Intermediate Club Player

So if Ivan says "Andy, you need to take the initiative a lot more if you are to win a slam" is he going to take notice because it is coming from a multiple slam winner when he has ignored the same advice from numerous previous coaches ?

gerry70 · Improver

What has he got to lose? I think this is a great appointment. Lendl was a tough competitor. Worth a shot.

Jan · Hall of fame

ooh interesting! Wasn't it rumoured a while ago?

philwrig · Hall of fame

Good appointment I believe, proof will be in the pudding though.

Madeline · Admin:Moderator + Tennis Legend

Yes, it was rumoured a while ago, and at the time I hoped it would happen. Who better than Lendl to understand the problems of failing in 3 Finals?

Armchair · County player

Well give it a whirl. Lendl's coaching history anyone ?

Madeline · Admin:Moderator + Tennis Legend

I don't think he has coached anybody, but I wouldn't expect him to be tinkering with Andy's tennis (except perhaps the serve). I would think he is there as a mentor - he certainly knows what it is like to be constantly under pressure to get a slam win, and he overcame that hurdle.

Reeltime · Satellite level

Lendl has no experience coaching at the top level. He has a school in the US for juniors (dont they all?) However he is widely respected as a source of advice, and has experience of turning a losing record into a winning one (Ivan lost his first 4 GS finals, then went on to win 8!)

Ratty · County player

Sorry, am I missing something here?

How does Lendl's experience of losing his first 4 GS finals - over 28 years ago - mean that he can somehow magically make Andy Murray win his next one?

After all, I too can empathise with what Andy was feeling after losing his 3rd GS final in a row. Something along the lines of : "Goodness me, that's a bit of a pisser."

And I can also have a pretty good guess what Andy should be thinking, when approaching his 4th final. Something along the lines of: "No, I'm not jinxed, I'll just keep plugging away, playing it point by point."

Can I be Andy's coach now? I'll probably be cheaper than Ivan.

Madeline · Admin:Moderator + Tennis Legend

I suspect he has more tennis knowledge than you, and having actually done something (such as turning around a losing record) has to have more insight than somebody imagining they know the problems and how to solve them.

Andy has always said that he needed somebody who knew what it was like, so that was why I was disappointed when the first rumours fell through.

RJA · Hall of fame

kundalini wrote:
So if Ivan says "Andy, you need to take the initiative a lot more if you are to win a slam" is he going to take notice because it is coming from a multiple slam winner when he has ignored the same advice from numerous previous coaches ?

To a degree this is the thing that worries me the most. What I hope is that Andy appointing Lendl is a big step towards him finally accepting that he needs to do something a bit different if he is to take the final step.

Ratty · County player

kundalini wrote:
So if Ivan says "Andy, you need to take the initiative a lot more if you are to win a slam" is he going to take notice because it is coming from a multiple slam winner when he has ignored the same advice from numerous previous coaches ?

What evidence do you have for thinking that if Andy takes the initiative more, this will make him more likely to win a Slam? Why wouldn't it make him less likely?

I've just started reading "Thinking Fast and Slow" by Daniel Kahneman. He writes in the introduction:

"A recurrent theme of this book is that luck plays a large role in every story of success; it is almost always easy to identify a small change in the story that would have turned a remarkable achievement into a mediocre outcome."

And:

"We are prone to overestimate how much we understand about the world and to underestimate the role of chance in events."

So - in each of Andy's 3 GS final defeats he had the misfortune to play a guy who was in the zone from start to finish. Applying Occam's Razor, simple bad luck seems a more likely explanation for his failures, than spinning out a string of hypotheticals relating to incorrect tactics, failure to take the initiative, etc.

Pretentious, moi?

smile

indiana · Tennis legend

Ratty wrote:
What evidence do you have for thinking that if Andy takes the initiative more, this will make him more likely to win a Slam? Why wouldn't it make him less likely?
I've just started reading "Thinking Fast and Slow" by Daniel Kahneman. He writes in the introduction:
"A recurrent theme of this book is that luck plays a large role in every story of success; it is almost always easy to identify a small change in the story that would have turned a remarkable achievement into a mediocre outcome."
And:
"We are prone to overestimate how much we understand about the world and to underestimate the role of chance in events."
So - in each of Andy's 3 GS final defeats he had the misfortune to play a guy who was in the zone from start to finish. Applying Occam's Razor, simple bad luck seems a more likely explanation for his failures, than spinning out a string of hypotheticals relating to incorrect tactics, failure to take the initiative, etc.
Pretentious, moi?

OK, Andy could just put it all down to bad luck, with such as who he has met and when he has met them, and just carry on as he is hoping his luck will turn.

Or he can try and influence events more in his favour, by looking at some aspects of which he is in control that haven't been executed as well as they might be.

Of course luck plays some part, eg in how draws fall out, but the better player he makes makes himself, such as in improving how he has dealt with important moments in Grand Slam finals, the more chance he should surely have of winning that elusive Slam.

Not necessarily saying that any particular change, such as taking the initiative more would help him, although many reckon it would. But far better to my mind to seek to make himself better than carry on as is and hope some change in luck will deliver him a Slam.

Luck of some sort ( even if that is simply avoidance of bad luck ) tends to play a part in all sport. What a serious competitor / team must aim to do, by continual hard work and seeking to improve, is to move the odds more in their favour.

-- Edited by indiana on Sunday 1st of January 2012 06:59:05 PM