Week 22 - ITF ($75K + H) - Nottingham, Grass

steven · Tennis legend

RE: Week 22 - ITF ($75K + H) - Nottingham, Grass

steven · Tennis legend

jb288 wrote:
Was there all day today, saw quite a lot of different players. Mel was looking great against Fujiwara, completely outclassed her in the first and didn't get down when she went 0-3 in the second. She is absolutely a class above the likes of Lisa & Tara at the minute, and as she says is definitely not a 300 player - she has a penetration and accuracy on her shots which most of our girls do not, and is looking in the best physical shape I've seen her too. Hope this can translate into more wins.

Lisa - Lucy was an interesting match but only saw bits of it; Lisa's backhand as ever was great, but her forehand is still a bit vulnerable. She was playing a lot more consistently than at Notts last year but wasn't building points that well and getting down on herself. No obvious injury. Lucy is more of a textbook player with solid groundstrokes but a not-that-big serve; I think she is easily as good as Lisa from the 3 times I've seen Lisa play.

Caitlin Hindmarsh against Mel really struggled (though to be fair the wind was quite strong all day and it was very cold, so everyone was probably not at their best!), and didn't yet look comfortable at this level. I was impressed with Fran against Jade - she has a nice variety to her game and hits pretty hard given how tiny she is! Jade was impressive and great to watch, less passive than when I've seen her before, and as always looking extremely athletic and moving well; she is one player we have who you are always confident will get the ball back - but at the minute too many of them are midcourt, and she struggled to put away some winners. She was a break up against Lu in the first, deservedly (as was Lucy in her QR2 match, though I didn't watch that).

Tara wasn't really on song, but her opponent was a great grasscourter, huge and great coming forward, volleying lots. Tara's backhand kind of deserted her in the first set but she picked it up a bit in the second. Holly Richards surprised me, watched her win the 1st against Erakovic in front of a crowd of 2! She has a nice game actually, slice backhand was staying very low and a big serve; early in the second she got into a dispute with the umpire (wrongly, I saw the chalk), Marina upped her game and I assume that was it.

Lottie Fox has a big serve too, being rather tall, and although she was outclassed today by Glushko, there were some good moments for her to take away, and she showed some promise. Daneika I couldn't really work out - she seemed to lack a great deal of power but did some very good placement and was getting plenty of winners against a very aggressive Lee-Waters in what was a very long match. No huge weapons but plenty of potential and a great on-court attitude and energy.

Sam murray I didn't watch that closely but again she has a nice counterpunching game which is good to see, very solid. Seaborne I only watched for a while but she was struggling a bit with her groundstrokes, serve strong though, and looks a great athlete.

Mel definitely the star of the day though!

Thanks for all that, it's very interesting to find out a bit more about the performances that lay behind some of the results. smile

indiana · Tennis legend

steven wrote:

No, that's not what I was trying to say. At this time of year, whatever level of tournament is held, if it is held on grass, you're going to get a high quality field relative to the prize money on offer, so the low quality 25K/50K with fairly easy points isn't an option even if we wanted it to be. Indeed, I agree with the prize money increase, so that's not the issue.
What I meant was that the spread of results last year suggests that while the 50K was very tough for a 50K, it gave the home players a realistic chance to get some competitive matches in on grass and to pick up some points if they played really well (i.e. what we both think the LTA should be aiming for by the sound of it), whereas I'm not sure attracting even more top 100 players (for which holding the 75K and the 100K back to back is the issue ) will provide the same opportunities.
......

Cheers Steven for your reply. As you say we do have some of the same aims for our players, and I accept many of your points while still thinking the Nottingham fortnight in itself looks a good initiative which a few have been maybe a bit quick to prejudge. While I think Norttingham can provide good tests for our top players, and lower ranked players haven't really particularly lost out, it is maybe worth looking back and giving it more consideration after the 2 weeks of Nottingham 1 and Nottingham 2 / Birmingham. How will the fields overall have compared, what points will have been gained and as importantly what useful match experience will have been gained ? Certainly there looks to be the prospect of lots of good tennis action for spectators.

Clearly, yes, the very short grass court season is a real problem, I would suggest THE real problem. That combined with the fact that there is a Grand Slam during it, well at the climax ( I will come back to that ) puts it in a whole different ball park from the South American clay court tournaments, which by location, no Grand Slam etc. can wind along on their merry way giving out many points to many South American clay courters happy to stick in that environment.

I agree with you, and have thought before, that on the face of it, it would be a good idea to hold more fairly high level grass court tournaments AFTER Wimbledon. This would give more tournaments for these who are strong on grass and want to play there, without so many really top class players "invading" tournaments because of the looming grass court Grand Slam. The timing of the French Open is a real problem pre Wimbledon, but I don't see the real problem with providing more tournaments post Wimbledon, i.e. look at providing more of a proper season for grass courters rather than just essentially providing Wimbledon warm-up tournaments.

Essentially, I think the LTA is a bit stuck between a rock and a hard place as to how it arranges tournaments pre Wimbledon, since I think it is very difficult to please everyone with such a short timescale. But there may indeed be room for other thinking, such as providing worthwhiole tournaments post Wimbledon.

Re Queens, I have said before that it ( and possibly Halle ) should logically be ATP 500s. While clay and US Open "warm ups" are at masters level, it is quite ridiculous that no grass warm up is at a higher level than ATP 250, especially with the enormous strength of the Queens fields. I don't know how one goes about getting an ATP 250 changed to ATP 500 - i.e. as to how easy it would be to negotiate this with the ATP if the LTA could promise all the necessary elements re an ATP 500 would be put in place, but I can't see why the ATP would be in principle against it. What is it, 5 points for qualifying, 10 points for a last 56 win, 25 points for a last 32 win, bit farcical.

-- Edited by indiana on Sunday 29th of May 2011 11:08:47 AM

Madeline · Admin:Moderator + Tennis Legend

I have always understood the status of ATP tournaments depends mostly on the prize money available. As far as Queens is concerned, why pay out big money when the top players will come for peanuts anyway? However I do feel the ATP, in view of the very short grass season, could perhaps make Queens and Halle special exceptions to the rule and give the same points as a 500 even if the prize money is that of a 250.

RBBOT · Futures qualifying

I agree with you, and have thought before, that on the face of it, it would be a good idea to hold more fairly high level grass court tournaments AFTER Wimbledon. This would give more tournaments for these who are strong on grass and want to play there, without so many really top class players "invading" tournaments because of the looming grass court Grand Slam. The timing of the French Open is a real problem pre Wimbledon, but I don't see the real problem with providing more tournaments post Wimbledon, i.e. look at providing more of a proper season for grass courters rather than just essentially providing Wimbledon warm-up tournaments.
Why not just move Wimbledon back a bit?

PaulM · Tennis legend

I think Steven's point is whether the LTA were right to drop the post-Wimby grass swing at Felixstowe and Frinton (and did we not have a 10k in Oxford one year?), and replace them with a couple of hardcourt challengers as we did last year with Wrexham and Woking.

The first thing is this myth that continues to be delivered as fact that Brits have more exposure to, play more on, and should therefore be better on, grass. What a load of rubbish. Certainly, since the Latimer/Woodroffe/Pullin/Crook generation retired we haven't had a single "grass court specialist" to our name. We may have girls who like grass, or whose games are suited to grass, but that is something entirely different.

Felixstowe was well attended as a 25k because it was well organised and well supported by the local community, so players liked it.

Frinton (and Felixstowe as a 10k) are different matters. They were, to be frank, pointless events. Unless you were based in Britain or liked grass, there was no point in playing them. So what we had was an event full of lower ranked Brits playing, almost exclusively, because it was an event in Britain. None of the field were good enough to get anywhere near Wimbledon a few weeks before unless they'd been handed a qualies wildcard.

The foreigners there either had come over to play both events because they like grass, or because they saw them as easy pickings (like when Brits turn up in Africa, South America, Canada etc...)

The post Wimbledon grass swing was not beneficial to anyone. Players didn't go there to prepare for Wimbledon the following year, or to improve their games, they went because it was on their door step or the field was weak.

My view is that these events should come back, but should be pre-Wimbledon.

We should have a 10k during the week of French qualies, and a 25k the week after (you can play an event during the first week of main draw if you lose in qualies at Grand Slams now).

These then step up to a higher challenger second week of the French, a choice of a challenger or WTA the week after (I like the Birmingham/Nottingham split) and finally Wimbledon qualies.

If you want to have a grass court challenger after, or second week of Wimbledon somewhere, that's fair enough but again not sure I see the point.

Immediately after Wimbledon players should be getting onto the outdoor hardcourts.

My other view is that Bournemouth and Edinburgh need to go. Two 10ks on American clay is the most stupid thing we've got tournament wise right now.

Naomi C seems to be coaching Tara (not sure if just one off though) and suggested she is going to Copenhagen next week, which is without doubt one of the most stupid things I have ever heard. Presumably she expects to be put forward for a Wimbledon qualies wildcard by right - so why would you prepare at a WTA event on hardcourts?!

-- Edited by PaulM on Sunday 29th of May 2011 02:40:58 PM

LordBrownof · Futures level

Presumably you mean Tara, not Cav.

PaulM · Tennis legend

LordBrownof wrote:
Presumably you mean Tara, not Cav.

Oops - fixed that typo!!

steven · Tennis legend

Samantha Murray has beaten another seed, ex-top 50 player (6) Lindsay Lee-Waters (USA) WR 215 4-6 6-0 6-3 to qualify.

Perhaps having to play two matches in one day caught up with the 33yo American, but it's a brilliant pair of results for Samantha whatever way you look at it

jb288 · Satellite level

Can well imagine solid-yet-powerful Sam exploiting Lee-Waters' error-strewn, over-aggressive game, judging by how both played yesterday. Nice one Sam! Fingers crossed for 2/2...

indiana · Tennis legend

Unfortunately,

FQR : (3) Jing-Jing Lu (CHN) beat Melanie South (GBR) 4 - 6 6 - 1 6 - 3

Peter too · Tennis legend

R1: KEOTHAVONG, Anne (GBR) 108 v BROADY, Naomi (GBR) WC 253
R1: WEBLEY-SMITH, Emily (GBR) WC 241 v STEPHENS, Sloane (USA) 143
R1: WATSON, Heather (GBR) 117 v Q
R1: ROBSON, Laura (GBR) WC 237 v SAVINYKH, Valeria (RUS) 138
R1: OBRIEN, Katie (GBR) WC 221 v VOEGELE, Stefanie (SUI) 160
R1: MURRAY, Samantha (GBR) Q 730 v

Jajon · Club Coach

Looking (too) far ahead a possible Watson vs Robson quater final, that would be interesting!

jb288 · Satellite level

Gutted for Mel :( Looks like all the Brits are playing tuesday, so will prob head up then. Borwell & South playing together, as are Watson & Rae, Keothavong & Robson. Mel & Sarah should make a very strong team.

Oh, another thing - Anna Smith was there Saturday; I was standing next to some foreign player and she came over to chat to her - so couldn't help but overhear! - she was saying her foot was fine but both her knees are injured. Didn't say about how long etc tho... feel bad reporting that back, but wasn't eavesdropping at all!

indiana · Tennis legend

Certainly on the face of it can't complain about that first round draw. An avoidance of meeting seeds and an interesting all Brit match between Anne and Naomi.