Week 11 - ITF ($100+HK) - Nassau, Bahamas Hard

philwrig · Hall of fame

RE: Week 11 - ITF ($100+HK) - Nassau, Bahamas Hard

philwrig · Hall of fame

you guessed it saved again

philwrig · Hall of fame

another mp

albino · Intermediate Club Player

Heather loses 3-6 6-4 4-6

-- Edited by albino on Friday 18th of March 2011 05:50:17 PM

philwrig · Hall of fame

sadly on I think 6th mp Heather goes down not without alot of credit though.

albino · Intermediate Club Player

I'm distraught. But what a tremendous effort. I'd love to see a rematch in a year's time.

indiana · Tennis legend

Bleh

No fight that girl, that's the problem wink

That looks to have been quite a match, thanks for all the updates, some of the earlier ones I need to go back and read through more slowly.

I did think this was a match that really could go either way, no matter how highly Marino has got herself ranked, with the form Heather was bringing in. On the night I guess it could of, although looks as if Heather could never get her nose in front. But one would never ( or should never ) be counting her out till the end, especially while it is still reasonably close.

( Yet ) another good week for Heather, just would love one week sometime quite soon to be the big big week with over 100 ranking points. It will come though.

Anyway, with her MDWC for Miami, she will have close to a week now before she's back in action. Hope she gets a decent draw there and gets at least one win to progress even further up the rankings.

-- Edited by indiana on Friday 18th of March 2011 02:23:59 AM

Julia Carrot · All-time great

Awwhh

Never mind eh !!

Many thanks to the night owls smile

LordBrownof · Futures level

What a match, I was sick with nerves just reading through it this morning!

Seems like Heather has a great all round game. I hope her next coach works on her securing more first serves/cheap points. I think if she can improve that area of her game, her ranking will rocket.

steven · Tennis legend

My connection went down just after midnight, so many thanks to those who followed livescores and reported on the match unfolding. Sounds like as exciting a match as I expected and what happened just tends to corroborate the impression that she's playing at around WR 70-80 level at the moment.

Well done to philwrig for winning some money on the back of the bookies underestimating her ability to fight her way back in the second set.

Madeline · Admin:Moderator + Tennis Legend

albino wrote:

Heather loses 3-6 6-4 6-4

That had me a bit puzzled - it should read 3-6 6-4 4-6!

indiana · Tennis legend

LordBrownof wrote:

What a match, I was sick with nerves just reading through it this morning!

Seems like Heather has a great all round game. I hope her next coach works on her securing more first serves/cheap points. I think if she can improve that area of her game, her ranking will rocket.

That would certainly be good. That said, as we see so often, in general women's tennis even at the very top level has many players who don't generally get cheap points on serve. In general the serve is not a dominant weapon, it's often just getting the rally started. Games are much more 50 / 50 ( in fact last night's match went more in favour of the server than many ) and it does make it often so much more unpredictable, with the winner generally the player that gets on top from the back of the court.

So, I don't see here serve really as a great weakness just now, and it will probably never be a huge weapon because of her stature. But, yes, still definitely would be time well spent, more easy points and less hard work on court must always be good.

-- Edited by indiana on Friday 18th of March 2011 02:48:19 PM

Peter too · Tennis legend

Against lesser players Heather scores well with her service including quite a few aces but playing an opponent inside the top 100 it is different. Many of the players in the top 100 will I imagine have practiced returning services from men so few women will score cheap points with service. At that level it often seems to be more a case of avoiding giving your opponent an easy return than winning an easy point. Many girls get such low scores on second serve that they would probably do better to risk DFs and simply serve two first serves.

albino · Intermediate Club Player

Madeline wrote:

albino wrote:

Heather loses 3-6 6-4 6-4

That had me a bit puzzled - it should read 3-6 6-4 4-6!

Ooops! It had been a long night....

indiana · Tennis legend

Peter too wrote:

Against lesser players Heather scores well with her service including quite a few aces but playing an opponent inside the top 100 it is different. Many of the players in the top 100 will I imagine have practiced returning services from men so few women will score cheap points with service. At that level it often seems to be more a case of avoiding giving your opponent an easy return than winning an easy point. Many girls get such low scores on second serve that they would probably do better to risk DFs and simply serve two first serves.

I must say I don't agree with that as an analysis re low scores on 2nd serve or, allied to that, the strategy of taking such risks on 2nd serve.

The first serve itself is comparative to the men so much less a point winning serve anyway so a similar second serve is still generally not likely to be such an added point winner to overcome what I would say is the unacceptable risk of serving a DF.

Now, if 2nd serve stats were really as poor as you suggest then there might have been some foundation to your point, but that wasn't my impression. And having too much time on my hands just now I have just looked at the Indian Wells last 32 stats.

1) On second serve, only 2 women had lower than a 34% success rate : Petkovic 19% vs Bartoli ( 1st serve 50% ) and Rezai 26% vs Sharapova ( 1st serve 70% )

2) Overall, averaging the 1st and 2nd serve success %s of all 32 women did not show a huge divergence, and probably anything like the men. 1st serve success = 64.0 %, 2nd serve success = 44.8 %

Now on the day, I admit if you applied Petkovic's in particular first serve in % ( 73% first serve in % ) and Rezai's ( 44% first serve in % ) to their first serve success rate you arrive at a higher figure than their second serve success rate, I suspect that is more anomalous to just them on the day.

No, I go back to my point in my previous post that so much more so the serve just starts the rally in women' tennis, and with the second serve %s being not all low as you suggest, I am afraid I really do disagree the logic of this radical strategy.

Interesting thoughts though, but I can see why there's noone that I know of the top women currently trying it as a strategy.

Sorry to take this so annoyingly seriousy, but hey as I said I had spare time. I am now switching off and going out to get a life smile

-- Edited by indiana on Friday 18th of March 2011 06:57:29 PM