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Post Info TOPIC: Labour party in a mess


Tennis legend

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Labour party in a mess


Some people may say that the Tories are very divided, but the Labour party is in a right mess and has been for sometime.

7 resigned this morning. One has already lost the whip and is effectively independent.

Expect more to resign over the next few weeks.

My MP is Luciana Berger - I am not surprised she has resigned. The anti semitism she is getting is disgusting and the Labour party has not dealt with it.



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All-time great

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Theyve formed a new group called the Independent Group, I think Chukka Umuna is the highest profile. Been a long time coming, to be frank the Labour Party has been largely a mess since Corbyn took over and I would say is a) pretty much unelectable b) has proven inept at taking advantage of the Tory party leadership in fighting and incompetence over Brexit. Surprised this didnt happen sooner!

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JonH


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How any party has failed to take advantage of the utter shambles of May's Tory leadership is a mystery to me and a condemnation (if another one is needed) of party politics in the UK.

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...and equally disappointing are the Lib Dems and their failure to create anything other than the odd Vince Cable utterance at a time they could be making hay and bouncing back.

All the major parties are a shambles! Time for a new start!

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JonH


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Coup Droit wrote:

How any party has failed to take advantage of the utter shambles of May's Tory leadership is a mystery to me and a condemnation (if another one is needed) of party politics in the UK.


No mystery re Labour  - it be J Corbyn and his acolytes. And understandable that patience has run out for some in the Labour Party.

But yes there should be a real opportunity for another direction / party, one failed to be grasped by the Lib Dems.



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Tennis legend

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Politics is definitely crying out for a credible and viable party in the centre.

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So we'll be stuck with the Tories for the foreseeable future then. Foolish move in my opinion.

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Tennis legend

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Personally I cannot stand the current party system with parties forcing politicians to vote for the party stance rather than voting on their beliefs or community requirements.
I'd love it if everyone was independent and was elected on their political stance and this would allow politicians to work together rather than just tribalist groups as it is now.

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Tennis legend

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paulisi wrote:

Personally I cannot stand the current party system with parties forcing politicians to vote for the party stance rather than voting on their beliefs or community requirements.
I'd love it if everyone was independent and was elected on their political stance and this would allow politicians to work together rather than just tribalist groups as it is now.


While I agree we are currently being rather let down by the parties and things are far from coherent I certainly don't think that's the way generally to coherent long term government with plans that can hold together.

The party system is probably the best model for this, which is why it is the way throughout most of the world.

And actually in any event in a democracy I don't see how you can stop people declaring an allegiance together ( effectively parties ) and they will agree rules amongst themselves to be in that group. Then if the people elect a majority of them they will govern.

Human nature will be for people to coalesce together to take over the club, especially such an important club ( and that to me does bring more order ). So we will never have largely true independents in practice.



-- Edited by indiana on Tuesday 19th of February 2019 12:09:01 AM

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I have a lot of time for people prepared to stand up for their beliefs particularly if the are moderate clearly thought out and coherent. These 7 MPs have taken a stand against an incoherent view on Europe and are inclusive.

As an Olive eating left of centre individual they probably represent my view and where I would sit in the Labour Party, I have a lot of time for my MP who remains in the party and would still vote labour on that basis but if he were to make the same shift my vote would follow. The Conservative party has the same schism and unfortunately it is the far right and hard left cohorts in both parties weilding too much power disrupting a consensus view on either side.

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Love Jess Phillips quote of a few weeks ago, I thought I knew posh people until I went to Westminster, but they were only people who eat olives. I have now met some posh people and I would not trust them to hold my pint. By implication I now feel much better about eating olives and reassuringly competent at holding my pint. Not really the take home message she was after but.....

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Julia Carrot wrote:

So we'll be stuck with the Tories for the foreseeable future then. Foolish move in my opinion.


 Stuck with them anyway Julia...thought they would be out the last time but they still did it. no



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I have never know politics on all sides in such a mess as it is now. There is so little integrity, principles or leadership shown anywhere. It's a shocking state of affairs but I hope that out of this mess something better may arise?

As an aside, as the 7 are all keen on a new referendum, they are not as keen on their own seats being put up for a bi-election I see despite being a strong moral case for it to happen?

What a mess.


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 Its really not as bad as they say :)



Tennis legend

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Now 8 and I reckons this will grow by the weekend.

No problem with them not going for a bi-election, they still have left wing principles.
If there was a bi-election, it would split the left wing vote and give another party a chance to get in. I still think some would get in as an ndependent candidate.

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Tennis legend

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Three Tory MPs have now defected to this "Independent Group".

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