Property developers and the death of non league football clubs

Bob in Spain · Tennis legend

Property developers and the death of non league football clubs

paulisi · Tennis legend

I hate to say it, but there seems to be a lot more idiots knocking around at football both in non league and also in the league at the moment.

Numerous issues at the weekend with Southport and Chorley fans throwing pyro onto the pitch and then fighting outside the ground.
We have seen issues with Oldham and Wrexham fans in arranged fights and Oldham and Chesterfield. There are probably lots more instances.

wolf · Tennis legend

Very exciting tie for Wolves Women (top of our 3rd tier league) away against Newcastle (2nd in their 4th tier league) who had a crowd of 28,000 in their last round. Presumably they will hold it at St James Park, Ive never been so very exciting! Will be about 10x bigger crowd than anything our girls will have played in front of if the same crowd.

Ive been to over 20 Wolves games in the last season and a half. Really love it.

paulisi · Tennis legend

I'm hearing disturbing news about the financial problems of quite a few non league clubs.
Southend are the most notable and have failed to pay players on time and are being wound up by HMRC
If you go down to conference North, it is reported that 7 different clubs have failed to pay players on time.

Even the clubs with sugar daddies are losing money in unsustainable amounts. Solihull reportedly losing 1 million a season, Fylde are losing money with a reported 20k a week wage bill and gates of around 1000.

Clubs seem to be struggling from:
Reduced gate revenues - gates are up, but significantly more concessions
Higher energy costs
Higher security costs after numerous clubs impacted by crowd mis behaviour
Lack of sponsors prepared to invest - this is a national problem. UK Athletics have no sponsor, ECB has lost two of their three flagship sponsors.

indiana · Tennis legend

My very local club The Spartans ( less than 2 miles away ) are looking very good to top the Lowland League or at least do enough to get into the play-offs to get into the Scottish League.

They have gone a few points clear of Tranent Juniors and University of Stirling plus the other 2 title contenders, Celtic B and Rangers B, are not eligible for promotion.

I believe Jon knows someone from The Spartans, (ex).chairman/president?

The Highland League is going to be between Buckie Thistle and Brechin City, whilst Bonnyrigg Rose ( in their first season in the Scottish League ) and Albion Rovers are in most danger of dropping into the play-offs.

JonH comes home · Tennis legend

indiana wrote:
My very local club The Spartans ( less than 2 miles away ) are looking very good to top the Lowland League or at least do enough to get into the play-offs to get into the Scottish League.

They have gone a few points clear of Tranent Juniors and University of Stirling plus the other 2 title contenders, Celtic B and Rangers B, are not eligible for promotion.

I believe Jon knows someone from The Spartans, (ex).chairman/president?

The Highland League is going to be between Buckie Thistle and Brechin City, whilst Bonnyrigg Rose ( in their first season in the Scottish League ) and Albion Rovers are in most danger of dropping into the play-offs.

I do! Craig Graham - Id need to check he is still with them but he was chairman around 5 years back I believe !

JonH comes home · Tennis legend

www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/sport/football/spartans-chief-craig-graham-would-swap-mbe-reach-spfl-592743

indiana · Tennis legend

Wikipedia says that Craig Graham is the chairman.

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Spartans_F.C.

JonH comes home · Tennis legend

Harrogate Town have posted another heavy loss

thestrayferret.co.uk/harrogate-town-post-1-2-million-loss/

£1.2m is on top of £1.0 m last season and overall the owner, Irving Weaver has £4.4m owing to him now.

We get around 2400 average crowd, I think, each week, charge around £20 per average ticket (expensive for this level) so revenues are c£40-50k per match and then whatever we take at the bars and kiosks - which wont be much as, being frank, the ground has no space and at best I would reckon we take maybe £10k a match max on top

And that is before call match day costs and then the payment of players and staff etc.

And the £4.4m he has pumped in (and says he wont take out, and I believe him) has got us into the EFL in the first place, but being frank we are just about staying there - we got 17th in 20-21 season with 57 points and 19th last season with 53 points. So have averaged around 1.2 points per match. This season we are 20th place with 38 points from 37 matches so far, so the trajectory is not one of progress.

We have a richer benefactor than most clubs and can probably afford to use the cash and splash it around a little more , given our actual size and stature, but it is hardly sustainable and the downside is a manager who is the owners son and protected for life - these performances would not have kept anyone else in a job!

paulisi · Tennis legend

Most clubs are unsustainable.
Lots of National League clubs have bigger wage bills than league 2 and some will go under.

paulisi · Tennis legend

Ebbsfleet promted to National League, Fylde look likely to join them.

Huge match in the National League today on BT - sell out to decide the champions. Wrexham v Notts County. Total sell out in under 1 hour.

In National League North, Chester are bringing over 1000 away fans to Southport in agate likely to be double the best gate of the season.

South Shields almost promoted.

indiana · Tennis legend

Yes, Wrexham vs Notts County is a huge match. Maybe in retrospect it will be seen as sort of deciding the champions but not yet, especially if Wrexham don't win.

In particular a Notts County win would put them 3 points ahead with one less game left to play, 3 as against Wrexham's 4 games left. So would be even more very much still all to play for in the remaining matches.

Given both their records ( each on 100 points and miles ahead of 3rd ) it is probably going to be really demoralising for whoever has to go into the play-offs. I hope they both end up being promoted.

-- Edited by indiana on Monday 10th of April 2023 12:59:27 PM

indiana · Tennis legend

In Scottish non league, The Spartans have been confirmed as the Lowland League's representative in the play-offs and will face either Buckie Thistle or Brechin City from the Highland League. These two meet in the final round of fixtures in 2 weeks' time and that match will quite likely decide the Highland League title and thus the Highland League play-off rep.

The Lowland League vs Highland League play-off winner will then face the bottom club in Scottish League 2 in a final play-off for a place in the league. The bottom of League 2 is very tight with just 4 or 5 matches to go.

paulisi · Tennis legend

Wrexham won 3-2 with Ben Foster saving a late pen.
Wrexham almost up.

I hope Notts County get through the playoffs. Both teams inflating wages at this level.

paulisi · Tennis legend

Looks like a reshuffle in National League North next season with more Southern teams being moved in.
3 x Southern teams to be relegated from National League. S****horpe only Northern team to be relegated