Davis Cup 2018 World Group R1 - Spain v Great Britain - 2-4 February

Coup Droit · Tennis legend

Davis Cup 2018 World Group R1 - Spain v Great Britain - 2-4 February

Sim · County player

I have been mulling over this a bit before posting....

Firstly practical issues 5 group matches plus SFs and Finals equals 7 matches so teams will play every day Monday to Sunday. If this is held the week after the ATP tour finals then the finalists will play in London on Sunday evening so they can't play in say Singapore 12 hours later. So how is that going to encourage the worlds' best to participate? Or do we extend the season by another week - doesn't sound like a good idea.

A compromise solution could be to keep the existing format up-to the QFs and then play the SFs and final in 1 week at the same venue (like cricket T20). So still have some home ties but have a big(ish) finale

I do agree with CD the current format having 1 doubles match on the Saturday is a weakness, and the issue of dead rubbers could be resolved by having points for every rubber which count for rankings. So say 10 points per rubber and 50 points for winning the match so 100 points at stake.

Also agree on 2 player teams - players should be restricted to 2 rubbers only so have to have at-least 4 players actually play.

skibbarriz · Strong Club Player

All the journalists, commentators, whoever, who have spent their time saying the Davis Cup isn't good enough because Rafa et al aren't there, now look like breaking it.

I understand that there is an ITF vote that needs to happen in August before this proposal it passed.

If this new event is introduced and the current DC format is eliminated, then they should call this new thing something else. Because the Davis Cup will have ended and they will have replaced it with something else.

Born2WinTennis · Club Coach

I agree with most of CD's points. A change is definitely required. A much more simple option would be to simply make it bi-annual...but where's the increased revenue from doing that? I'm not sure why Pique has anything to do with it, why don't Rakuten just sponsor it directly, although are BNP Paribas not the long term sponsors...#confused.

christ · Futures qualifying

I think that it is a bit off that we have a competition that notionally represents the country but is actually only contested by three (or max five) people. This means that it isn't really a test of a nation's strength but of its strongest player (literally in the UK's case).

Whilst inhabiting my little fantasy land, I would propose that it should be a team game, perhaps like the Ryder Cup, with at least ten competitors from every nation, in some combination of singles and doubles (and wheelchair, perhaps?). Played over four or five days, so that the initial games on Wed-Fri (or Thur-Fri) set the stage for a spectator-friendly weekend.

JonH · All-time great

Born2WinTennis wrote:
I agree with most of CD's points. A change is definitely required. A much more simple option would be to simply make it bi-annual...but where's the increased revenue from doing that? I'm not sure why Pique has anything to do with it, why don't Rakuten just sponsor it directly, although are BNP Paribas not the long term sponsors...#confused.

From what I understand, this process started with ITF looking at the DC options for the future. The ideas they recommended last season ended up in an end of year 4 team event in one single location as we all might remember.

Alongside that, Pique and his backers came up with the concept of a World Cup of Tennis. they floated it to and started discussions with the ATP who seemed keen and a target date of holding it in January 2020 came around, ie as a season starter type event. For some reason these talks halted a little, and the ITF clearly seeing the World Cup as a rival to their ideas of the DC being held as above, started talks with Pique. So in essence the two things came together , Pique with the financial backing to make it happen (prizemoney etc) and ITF with a willingness to morph the DC into it.

As you say, not sure if it is implied Rakuten will be sponsors or just backers of it (with their banking hat on ) and of course where it leaves relationships with BNPP, presumably all of that will come out in the wash.

In terms of ATP, not sure if they were really into the idea or not - suspect that as it frees up 3 weeks now in the main season, they will use this to crash more events into their calendar or spread out those in triple event weeks, but suspect they actually arent too disappointed with the outcome - ATP doesnt really do Team tennis, the old ATP World Cup crashed a few years ago due to lack of interest (this was the Dusseldorf event) and the ATP never really appeared to have much desire for it.

My worry is that after a few years where folks are interested in the new format, it will also dwindle. As an aside, I was watching the World Table Tennis Cup event in the Copper Box on telly these past few days, similar concept, 12 nations in one place etc. It seemed to work quite well in terms of excitement , top players and crowd numbers, so maybe the concept can be made to work and I should stop being cynical!

indiana · Tennis legend

christ wrote:
I think that it is a bit off that we have a competition that notionally represents the country but is actually only contested by three (or max five) people. This means that it isn't really a test of a nation's strength but of its strongest player (literally in the UK's case).

Whilst inhabiting my little fantasy land, I would propose that it should be a team game, perhaps like the Ryder Cup, with at least ten competitors from every nation, in some combination of singles and doubles (and wheelchair, perhaps?). Played over four or five days, so that the initial games on Wed-Fri (or Thur-Fri) set the stage for a spectator-friendly weekend.

Yes, superb at the time as it was when GB won the Davis Cup, like CD and yourself I think it very anomalous that the tennis team event of the year can be largely won just on the efforts of Andy and his brother ( nae not even all these LTA bods that got their sickening bonuses on the back of it, that needn't have gone very far past Leon but anyway I diverge ). Yes, James Ward won vs USA but in theory Andy and Jamie could have played the Bryans and won and it is clearly possible to win the whole shebang with one great singles player who can play good doubles with a good partner.

The influence of one player should certainly be diluted somehow, from not being able to play 3 out of 5 matches to something more like you mention with much bigger teams. And even annoying the French when we beat them with the existing 5 match format doesn't quite justify it.

That you can change though without throwing out the baby with the bathwater.

And every two years rather than every year is something I could have gone with too.

-- Edited by indiana on Wednesday 28th of February 2018 06:23:22 PM

Smudge226 · Strong Club Player

This proposal is just plain weird. The top 16 nations will not play again for a year after these new finals. It'll surely have to be annual, you couldn't have the top16 waiting for 2years or more to play again and possibly never ever at home.
Last season's suggestion of semis and a final at a single venue suddenly seems much more appealing. A stretch to this could be A last 8 finals so at least the top16 can experience home/away once a year.

Born2WinTennis · Club Coach

Wow this story is beginning to grow arms and legs, apparently the ATP were in talks with Pique but could not agree terms on location asia vs Australia...but are now about to propose an alternate world cup of tennis event...the phrase p1ss up in a brewery springs to mind.

www.bbc.co.uk/sport/tennis/43409616

JonH · All-time great

Born2WinTennis wrote:
Wow this story is beginning to grow arms and legs, apparently the ATP were in talks with Pique but could not agree terms on location asia vs Australia...but are now about to propose an alternate world cup of tennis event...the phrase p1ss up in a brewery springs to mind.

www.bbc.co.uk/sport/tennis/43409616

I was literally going to post something on this! As you say, very confused picture. Previous stories mentioned Pique talking to both organisations and ITF had appeared to usurp ATP. But this puts more detail on it and suggests it all is very much up in the air.

several things spring to mind:

1) Cant have two similar events, would be crazy

2) Surely merging it all together would make sense

3) ATP did a World Cup a few years back, 8 nations played in Dusseldorf just before the French. It all faltered as players lost interest post the years of McEnroe and lendl etc. This will go the same way I suspect, whichever one moves forwards.

4) January actually sounds better than December to me. and players appear to prefer that option according to article

5) Hopman Cup has that slot and is very similar. Presumably that also couldnt co exist or could it??

JonH · All-time great

Just to add some background>

ATP idea been floated since September so not totally new, ITF and ATP heading for a battle

uk.reuters.com/article/uk-tennis-men-world-exclusive/exclusive-tennis-world-team-cup-with-ranking-points-could-start-in-2019-idUKKCN1BI2V2

this article suggests a 24 nation event is muted v ITF 18 nation event

www.tennisworldusa.org/tennis/news/Tennis_Stories/50445/world-team-cup-to-be-reintroduced-in-the-atp-calendar-in-2019-or-2020/

And this is the wiki link showing nothing new under the sun!!

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Team_Cup

Smudge226 · Strong Club Player

Yet again all the top players are making themselves available for the DC quarters 6th April, Belgium aside who are away in US, not sure about Goffin who usually supports his nation. What's the problem..? Looks like Nadal, Zerev, Cilic, Sock, Pouille etc etc all playing, no problem at all since this year the QF does't follow a GS, which is the real issue.

the addict · Tennis legend

I don't think Goffin is fit. He retired in Rotterdam last month, missed Indian Wells, and got thumped on his return in Miami in his opening match.

flamingowings · All-time great

the addict wrote:
I don't think Goffin is fit. He retired in Rotterdam last month, missed Indian Wells, and got thumped on his return in Miami in his opening match.

He got hit in his eye by a mis hit ball off his own racquet. V nasty and unlucky.

-- Edited by flamingowings on Thursday 29th of March 2018 04:23:59 PM

-- Edited by flamingowings on Thursday 29th of March 2018 04:24:37 PM

Born2WinTennis · Club Coach

Interesting article on ATP vs ITF plans in the Telegraph today, apparently all the players are firmly behind the ATP rather than the ITF idea:

Conflicts of interest are two-a-penny. Take the position of super-agency IMG, which is acting as a consultant in negotiations between the ITF and Kosmos. Yet Gavin Forbes, managing director of IMG Tennis, also sits on the seven-man ATP board. In July he will have to vote on whether to green-light the ATPs World Team Cup, which leaves him in an awkward position to say the least.